VC Office Hours #1

Transcript

hi everyone good morning good afternoon good evening depending on where you based hi everyone Hi hi hi Stan hi Jerome hi Oliver hi young hi Hae and hi Matthew Our Guest today um okay so it's uh 2 1 p.m. C so because I want to be mindful of time we will start immediately um the event so my name is RF I am um the new co-chair of the CVA startup and Venture working group so um it has been around for about

three to four years now and we are together with evi joining as a co-chairs with fresh idas and we are here to Leverage What has been already built throughout those years and um speaking about having fresh IDs this is exactly what we are intending to do today uh so the name of the event is called VC office hours and the idea is to introduce interaction because our big idea for this like revamp working group is to try to strengthen the links between entrepreneurs and investors and we believe that having such an event like a VC office hour is the best way

you know to to have those two stakeholders on both sides of the table engage with each other and try to um as soon as possible create interesting links and uh what I mean by interesting is uh having some investors invest in entrepreneurs um so um today I'm very pleased to have Matthew Shon with a founding partner at a very early Ventures based in zurk it's a very early stage as the name would say um we three investor and um so myself a CO co-chair of the of this Venture group myself um raising my web3 fund preced web3 fund and I am also um a community builder for

base in Switzerland so Bas is coin basis layer to on ethereum so very active in the space and in the country but with uh I would say a bigger ambition than just Switzerland and this is exactly what the crypto valy is about um Swiss roots and with global Ambitions so without further Ado um I will just ask Matthew to introduce himself so with one question actually um can you tell us uh what types what is the type what are the types of Founders teams entrepreneurs that you are willing to back with very early and um what are the

teams if you want to illustrate that that uh thesis what are the teams that you've already backed since deploying from your from your fund so the floor is yours mat for about one to to two minutes great um thanks so much uh R for for having me here and and great to see more and uh uh rejuvenated activity from the crypto Valley uh startup group so to answer your questions around who we back and what kind of Founders we like um and where we can collaborate best let me give you a very short intro of myself and and kind of the fun background story so I got into crypto by doing a PhD at eth surc in distributed

systems that was from 2016 till 2020 just got lucky uh that I was kind of shed into ethereum in the very Beginnings um I worked for tread VCS uh doing Tech DD on the side of the PHD and then I joined maker doll I let product efforts there let a spin-off it failed I joined cell who I knew um because one of the Venture funds I worked for during the PHD actually invested in their first round together with andreon and then eventually raised the fund together with two friends that I knew from PhD times in 2022 so we're live since two years now we've invested in 18 companies and that background is kind of relevant

because so we are very technical we technical investors and so we tend to like technical Founders it's not an exclusive uh We've backed all kind of different types of uh people um but you where we have a unique kind of uh angle is if people are technical if they build technical stuff um because we understand that very well maybe quicker than other people that are investing and because also our network is uh centered around these types of products so about half of the people that have invested in our fund are crypto Founders like people from the defi space in uh Europe mostly um yeah to give you some examples

like what we've backed so for example uh We've invested in predicate which is kind of a new type of Oracle based system to uh create prerequisites for transactions so Define something that needs to be fulfilled before a transaction is executed there currently using that for compliance and um so on a complexity level it's like something similar to an oracle network uh so that's something that we like a lot or we've invested in a fluid key which is Building Sales addresses across evm so started very technical but has now become more a kind of an onchain neobank um or we have also invested in deep pain so I'm on the on the board of

the impossible Cloud Foundation they're doing uh storage and compute selling that to smmes so that's less technical on the crypto side because crypto is just used to coordinate the network and the founders are also less technical they're basically like in their 40s great salespeople um but we were of the opinion that specifically in deepin the demand is often missing and uh that these guys could create demand and that's what they've done so they're now at over 4 million ARR nine months after launch so 44 dein that's that's pretty good so yeah to sum up pretty wide spectrum we're looking bottom up who is building something interesting and and

then where can we help okay super thank you so much so you're quite a technical investor so this is exactly spot on for the three topics of the day because we wanted for this first iteration of the VC office hour to have three topics so the first topic is about I mean it's not the first but one of the three topics is toomics design and implementation the third topic is interoperability in web 3 and um the third sorry the second and the third is a scalable web three infrastructure so uh going forward in the next office hours we will have only one topic so that we will maximize you know the focus but here we want to explore so

um this is not a Twan show um people who are participating to this event this is not a Twan show so I'm here not to moderate and try to you know orchestrate the discussion but really the floor is yours so um the idea is that you just raise your hand and you ask you know to just to to ask question to Matthew so we we have the team helping you you know get into you know the the right order when it comes to asking the question to mat and please please please ask all your burning questions this is the big idea of today um and before doing so please just say your name maybe where you based if it is relevant and what you

are building but very quickly not big intro just so that mat understands um at a high level your background and ask questions related to those three topics so maybe before having one or two you know immediate question from the attendance um I'd love to ask you Matthew when it comes to interoperability in web 3 if it is really realistic as a goal you know uh or um is it like a wishful thinking something that everyone would love at some point to achieve but but but but in reality we will remain in fragmented systems so is it realistic Utopia

wishful thinking and uh yeah are we going to be stuck you know in fragmented system as as today we see a lot of Endeavors when it comes to get systems interoperate uh it seems like it's not you know achievable yet or maybe it is already achievable so what's your what's your take on that yeah so I I think it depends a bit on the perspective right on what level will we have great interoperability or not I think it is uh indispensable that from an end users's perspective everything will be interoperable right if you think about you using the web you just go to Chrome you type in whatever you want and you

don't care if it's stored on AWS or Google cloud or whatever and this service that service I just pops up here it is you can add it and so on that level it's kind of like everything all these systems are interoperable they deliver what you want to your surface and you're kind of always in your same surface namely your browser and I think the same is happening in crypto um we don't really know which service will uh own the user in the end right is it going to be wallets or like kind of uh def super apps like zerons or uh something else uh base and coinbase who own a lot of users uh but somewhere they will

congregate and from there you will have to be able to access any given service that is interesting for you as an end user no matter on which chain it is and how you pay for gas and so on so just from a Necessities perspective I think interoperability on that level is is needed uh it's certainly not there yet but we see many great teams working on this um like the basic ground level messaging um layer is being built you know by great teams like the layer zeros the hyperlanes uh sockets and so on and more and more we see applications that are that are using that to build cross uh cross chain uh apps I think currently most of this is needed in the evm space

right where well okay on base you have quite a lot of usage being uh centered but on many other chains there's also usage but not that much and you want to tap into different types of chains and and it's cumbersome um if you speak more technically right as a developer how easily can you Deploy on different chains and will like all these tools uh interoperate and the basic Vision with which we started in web 3 which was that you know all the are interoperable and all the apis are open and you can just tap into whatever

you want I think on that level it's going to be a bit more complex right as always in it you need lots of pipes to put things together and eventually somehow it becomes interoperable but it's kind of a burden on the individual developer I I guess that will remain the same uh in the blockchain space as well um yeah as investors given what I just said we we invest in in in in all of this because I think interoperability is a big topic so we invest in more user Centric apps which try to Leverage The Tech that exists and add a little bit to it to make easy nice cross-chain uh experiences possible uh but we also

invest on a lower tech level into infrastructure which enables that interoperability okay super thank you mat so we started uh by talking about interoperability uh so has anyone a burning question um is anyone facing a challenge a choice or an opportunity when it comes to interoperability please raise your hand and um and take this opportunity to ask Matthew a specific question about something that you are facing but because we started by interoperability it doesn't mean that you have to talk about interoperability you know so you can talk about uh anything uh related to the three topics that we wanted to address today the scalable infrastructure and obviously

toonomic design so please uh who wants to start and who has a specific question to ask Matthew to get uh his his juice and his Insight yes Hae please go ahead well good afternoon everyone this is Hae I'm based on Switzerland I'm a Founder CEO of reward me uh which we are trying to build this project in xrpl network and we're currently invested in web and metaverse base in the xrpl network which is called the expector I don't know if you're familiar with that it's the they're the only project in xrpl that actually building the metaverse and there are a lot of

many projects that building inside the world is kind of like de centraland and all that kind of stuff and my question is I feel like I'm getting invested in this uh ecosystem already especially in the xrp and we we're talking about inter comparability and then how can I uh how do you call it how can I feel good about like that security way that so in the future like all metaverses will be interconnected and because I feel like it all depends individually on how are these developers and how the the how smooth will be the the connection will

be you know if that makes sense right thanks I me yeah um so I mean I don't really know the xrp ecosystem to be honest so I I'm I'm I've rarely seen people working on interoperability with that specific ecosystem so can't really talk too much about that generally uh what I'm seeing uh is that um yeah anywhere where there's really demand for interoperability eventually somebody starts uh to build uh uh the the rails to to connect um the the the different base layers um so we've certainly seen that around the

cosmos ecosystem and around uh connecting Solana and and the whole evm world again XR I'm I'm not an expert on and ultimately I think it just depends on kind of well two things what are the needs of your users right is the app that you're building um enough uh for users to you know um have everything that they want or is it more a kind of a superco composable thing where you don't really own the user and you're not the front end but you need to uh attract flow from somewhere else and then on the other hand um what are the capabilities of you as a developer and and the tools that

you need um do you need interoperability for that on a lower level uh Tech layer um yeah depends very much on on the app yeah maybe one question to haime actually why did you choose to explore that ecosystem uh maybe instead of exploring another ecosystem that may be a bit more I would say already explored by other builders and also used by more users what has led your choice well I started trading uh crypto in the beginning like seven years ago and I got into to the first top few cryptos and xrp is one of them and I

start to read their uh white paper and all this get familiar with different networks and I believe in like the network itself because uh I use Solana ethereum and all this kind of stuff and there's a lot of like especially if you're a Trader you're trying to avoid fees and all that you know and like ethereum network has costing me so much money and some assets that I bought especially nfts back then I can't even move them or transfer it or trying to because it just cost money and then I tried uh xrpl and I started with the summon wallet and there's a lot of decentralized exchanges which is flawless I never had problems and for the six years of being there in that

Network we don't have any crashes we don't have any hacks samon is the only wallet that I know that they never been hacked and all this kind of stuff I'm not trying to put up xrp I'm speaking uh on my own experience so that's why I decided to hey get uh involved with the project because after knowing a lot there's a lot of I realize there's a lot of people building in the network nowadays and with these meters coming on top and they're they're helping the ecosystem and welcome new projects and developers and I'm coming from the uh business perspective of things I'm not a developer but I have a huge team that is actually uh working with us which is uh

Mak me feel confident that we could uh uh be on the space and do good with the business so that's why I choose xrp in that case yeah it's more like the the peace and the stability stability of the network understood thank you R for the clarification so who's next who has a question to mat could be either about interoperability orconomics or um scaling infrastructure so who wants to go next okay so maybe I can ask you a question when it comes toomics mat um do you think that um those toonomic that have been kind of in place since the Ico craze and more recently with the the

recent hype that faded a bit about a year and a half ago when it comes to yeah when it comes to engaging Community developers and um early investors in a project do you think that um to economics that are prevailing at the moment are broken and what could be one two three things that the founders uh should avoid uh when deciding you know um their token utility uh so that they just I would say um get to toonomic 3 3.0 you know um what could be you know the insights and the learnings from I

would say the broken economics that that we saw in the past two three four years that now funders will be able to avoid so that um there is a better hygiene when it comes to toomics yeah so first question is is tokenomics broken and and and I wouldn't say simple yes right I I don't think like all the tokens that are out there now are bad and they are down only because they were not well designed and in the future if we only design them in a right way then they will be up to the right and uh green again so I think um currently just in the market retail demand is lacking

uh simple as that uh so that's why a lot of tokens are not up we also have a lot more tokens that we've had previously I'm not really a big fan of the viewer that all because of that tokens start down like we've always had tons of tokens and we have billions of uh maybe not billions but uh a lot of stocks as well and they're even though there are a lot like they're not down only um I think it's very much Case by case so you know some tokens uh have clear utility have a right to uh get earnings uh in some indirect way and and benefit from the underly

protocol develop and uh many others don't really and so if I look at the price currently it's not based on the token utility it's based on a lot of other factors and and so I also think changing the token utility doesn't really change to price action currently for sure what needs to change is how tokens are being launched um I mean that's been widely discussed right so we have these high FTV low float token launchers um they launching the tens of billions and it's very clear nobody can make money on on top of that and um that has kind of killed retail demand but

that's not really the utility of the token that's more how it is launched and how the supply is being managed so I think if you're a Founder right uh think about a reasonable launch price also in terms of FTV uh think about reasonable inflation and how you leverage your token to grow your network it needs to be sustainable in the long run uh users have learned that you know not just everything skyrockets uh just because it's a token so that is for me the main learning um how you capture value um you need to capture value somehow uh but how you can do that is a very Case by case of what you're

building and Al also of the current regulatory environment which is extremely fluid at the moment right so I'm thinking around tokens in the kind of like a smiley curve you know we started with uh basically there were security tokens uh it promised you the kind of like same uh rights as uh stock you if there's money being earned you get it but it started with products that never launched so you never earned money and then you had regulatory pressure and like okay only utility tokens nothing wanted to be a security and so the tokens are often value less and now we are going into a regulatory regime where

you can attribute a lot more power to the Token if you do it sensibly and so the utility is clearly there but well you still need to Define uh and and build a product with actual usage so the underlying token uh has value and you need to think very uh ly around different jurisdictions and and what is possible where thanks mat yes Z please can you unmute yourself or shall we do it for you okay no I have done it um so thank you for the interesting insights I have two questions and my second one is uh obviously Matthew can answer but also maybe Rafael you can also given your background in private banking Rafael and

I were called yeah we met a long time ago yeah at one point in time at HSBC so my first question is um uh you know I'm also talking internationally in the US as you mentioned Matthew regulation has become extremely fluid and people are confused given also the new Administration uh there are a lot of projects and people are talking about ton toomics and you know creating um different tokens and Investments are they Securities are they not Securities now people talk meme coins are not Securities um I don't know if how is the situation in Switzerland maybe I will be

interested to get a bit more regulatory insight and would it be okay for for example other jurisdictions um to use tokens or create companies for example in jurisdictions like um Switzerland um so that's my first question and the second is again given the private banking Grant sometimes clients ask these questions obviously the more mature clients are very worried because they keep always hearing horror stories too they are sometimes a bit older and you know the typical private Banker is not an expert on these areas they're also a bit worried um but sometimes they're also interested some are very savy especially the younger generation but if someone

shows interest obviously there companies like swisco they have product Structured Products or just simple funds or very simple ways to get exposure uh um but is there a way for maybe even the bankers themselves to be a bit educated and to find U you know smart and dependable uh ways to have exposures or even knowledge and talk about you know these issues that are still somewhat new you know yeah sure mat you want to go first for the question number two which was the first question asked uh yeah so number two I mean uh yeah there's tons of areas where you can get knowledge uh right I

mean depending on how much time you can dedicate to the area um still a lot of great discussions happen online and and in public right on on Twitter on Discord um Etc or telegram groups however if you want to go that route I guess you have to be kind of 100% or 200% in uh to distinguish noise and and real information so that's you know what the professionals uh like R and me are doing um if if you are a relationship manager or you have clients you have a family office and you can maybe dedicate 1% of your time to this you need to be highly filtered right uh it's also if you

deploy 1% of assets you don't want to spend 5% of your time on it and so there I mean there we see people investing in us like a fund uh to get that exposure right it's on the one hand side monetary exposure but it's also the information exposure right you have a guy you can call him up um and tell him hey what are the most important happenings last quarter how is the market doing why is it down uh Trump is like great but tokens are down why is this happening so I have LPS calling me and asking these questions and they they do it maybe three times in two weeks because they have three meetings where they need good answers and then they don't talk to me

for like half a year so it's kind of like on demand uh hey give me the info and uh so so that's for sure like the the the the uh the most white cloth service that you can imagine um something in between is yeah just networking in Switzerland I mean I don't know the scene in Geneva that well but in Zurich there are a bunch of meetups happening build your network even if you don't invest in very early Ventures if you know me uh you know you can reach out see me at a networking event and ask me a few things and you do that maybe once every two months and you're at least kind of plugged in to the markets uh to to a

certain extent so thanks does it answer your your question what was again your first question uh is it something that my first first question was more about jurisdiction yes jurisdiction and and regulation for example if someone creates a a tokens and people invest would they be registered Ed by finma or regulated you know this whole question in us are they Securities are they under yeah we have a working group a legal working group from what I know uh at the CVA so maybe that's going to be a more suitable working group you know if you have like very specific questions when it comes to regulation and legal things so happy to do an introduction with that would be very happy to yes I think that

that will be more helpful for you thanks so ra you wanted to ask a question again please go ahead uh and I want to be mindful of the time of everyone so we're already halfway into the session so we are uh still 30 minutes to go uh so please take those 30 minutes as an opportunity to ask your burning question and happy to to have you again ask a question please yeah uh first of all uh yeah I started a project and I contact mme these are the crypto Law Firm here in Switzerland and uh I was surprised with the the fees that I have I'm facing currently to get the regulation the licensing uh because I'm leading towards uh this is my Q one of the projects were

very early and but I want the Ico to happen very soon in before Q2 or before Q3 but the problem is like the fees and like I think one lawyer told me like the the fees for the lawyer itself will cost me 50,000 Franks plus PMA will be charging at least minimum of 10,000 so for us startups is like immediately like 60,000 in Switzerland I know that uh we are one of the best uh you know uh regulat regulation here in Europe so uh now I'm feeling like I'm being forced to uh look into Dubai to start my business there because due to the starting cost of uh such a project so what can you my

question is uh what do you advise uh startups that are dealing with this uh Fe and all that yeah so I mean tldr from my view is yes lawyers are extremely expensive and mme are probably the most expensive ones however they are also the most experienced ones and so depending on what you're building uh it might be worth uh paying up for that right and there are not that many alternative uh which play in the similar league and if they do it's kind of like uh also similar price you know not exactly the same but but not 5x difference so my my Approach is

to uh if we talk with our Founders that we invest in right to to take uh risk-based approach and say if you're very early and uh depending on what you build um and your exposure to risk legal risk is not that big uh you can go for the beginning with like a a l wellknown Law Firm um it also depends a bit on the jurisdiction so we invest in Founders worldwide mostly Europe and us um so if you're based in Switzerland and you work on something which is like you know close to Securities Law you want to have some trading venue or so unfortunately I think there is no way around from

getting things right from the very beginning because simple errors in the beginning can cost you extremely year later down the road and so you just have to raise enough money to get that legal cost covered yeah you wanted to ask a followup yeah I just want to cut there because uh like uh yeah I started the purpose of the project is to uh serve as utility coin for The xrpl Ledger mainly uh for web uh web tree and uh metaverse so we are actually investing on digital asset these are Revenue generating assets in the metaverse which are uh producing quality nfts that 3D and uh gamified ones and we will We own like uh

digital Assets in the metaverse of xrpl and then uh we're actually building like gains in the future so I don't think we're more facing the security things because uh we position oursel as utility tokens but I understand that every Ico needs to have license here and uh but I was offered uh I was told by mme lawyer that I could do the some private s sales of the coin as long as I don't do any Ico and all that it should be fine and uh that's what I'm trying to do now to raise capital and once I raise the capital I was thinking to just pay the lawyer and all that because at the end of the day if I go to Dubai and all that I'll be facing similar charges and

all that when it comes to taxes here because I will still be based in Switzerland because my family is here yeah thanks for thanks for the for the context has anyone um a burning question about toomic could be also about interoperability and the IDE is also to talk about how to scale infrastructure so scalable infrastructure so maybe one question about that mat do you think there is and if yes what is one of the best or the few best I would say coste effective ways for startups you know to prepare their infrastructure for like a very rapid user growth without over engineering you know in the

first place their infrastructure sorry can you just repeat um yeah I was willing to learn from you if um early stage startups Founders um can already prepare their infrastructure for very rapid growth without spending too much or without uh you know deploying too much energy in over engineering you know their infrastructure at Day Zero you know suddenly they could face like a skyrocketing exponential growth when it comes to users and be just left behind because they were not prepared and sometimes this you know uh skyrocketing user growth may never happen and they

may have spent too much time too much effort too much energy in over in generating their infrastructure in the very beginning so what's could what could be the best trade-off you know to uh prepare for a huge growth in user you know action Without You Know by staying Nimble and by staying very focused and Laser focused on uh getting through the best infrastructure that is you know applicable to the St so I I mean my question will be longer than your answer maybe yeah not necessarily the the the answer is very complex right but I didn't get it because for me it's not blockchain specific question right it's

a very generic question whenever you build it uh whenever you build probably any type of product your V1 with which you go out how much do you optimize that for being the base for your V10 which will support billions of users if you're the next Mark Zuckerberg and how much you optimize for just ship fast test your idea and um specifically in the blockchain area what is a bit different is that smart contracts are hard to upgrade so maybe the optimization is a bit more important but uh again like it's hard to

give any reasonable answer to this I think it depends a lot on what do you think is your biggest risk so whenever we I I have a call with the founder I asked them hey what what do you think is the biggest risk that you're facing uh uh until you raise that round and then until you raise the next round and you need to deleverage that risk and if the risk the biggest risk is hey does anybody want this product then don't think about millions of users like just build something and try to see if you get to that Milestone where you've proven somebody wants the product and you can raise the next round and essentially start from scratch like you raise a lot of money you hire deaths a

tech problem solved if that's not your biggest problem if it's more like can we make that efficient enough so that it works out then you know the tradeoff are very different um but generally it's it's very hard how how much do you change long-term Focus versus short-term Focus speed versus long-term viability mhm yeah very Case by case yeah got you yeah young please go ahead you have a question I can unmute you if you don't manage to do it got it got it um my name is Ian grig uh I'm one of the earliest

um participants in the space I started in 1995 um my question oh the other thing I should say is that I'm working with a trust-based approach to uh digital exchange uh my question is related to the uh classical field of law and the way in which the crypto space has developed fairly quickly on since the launch of blockchain in a direction whereby legal processes have been pushed aside when those very legal processes are essential or useful if you like to keep out the Bad actors and more specifically there are things like uh

contracts by that I don't mean smart contracts I mean legal contracts written on paper uh which explain who the parties are what you're going to do and so forth so in general to what extent this is my question to what extent are you seeing the interest in bringing the classical Law Firm field into the domain of crypto in general um I I mean for me the two are very much uh linked already right whatever you build in on top of a blockchain is all so uh covered by existing law and and interpretation thereof um I don't really

see that uh blockchain applications are kind of completely rewrite um how we think about uh laws and legal action uh and so on so for me it's really bit like the internet or so it's new tech uh maybe you will have certain types of new legislation to cover things that were not possible before um that new tech existed but I don't really see that kind of new automated law mechanisms are are coming on train or or something like that so that was a bit my feeling that your

question was going in that direction but not sure if I actually have covered it yeah and just maybe to reframe uh thank you for the question Yang and the answer mat maybe to reframe bit the the the talk today so we have three topics that's the the ID of the VC office hours so um whenever you have a question that is slightly related to the topic or not too much related to the topics happy to get your questions by email and then root them to a relevant you know guest maybe not the guest we have today so let's try to be focused on the on the topics sorry to just to to mention that again but that's the the whole idea of the V office hour don't take it you know personally young but just I just wanted

to to maybe to refocus a bit of the discussion um Hae yes sorry you wanted to ask a question about toomics please go ahead yeah I'm currently deciding uh the supply of the coin that we're trying to create so I don't want to go over like the billion uh Supply because of we're not meme coin as utility we're jumping between like couple of hundred million into maybe like uh yeah 100 million so what are the advantage of having or disadvantage of having uh huge amount of supply and small amount of supply and uh what about black hole type of uh tokenomics uh is there uh much better

for startups to have limited uh Supply or like just open so we can mint the token again yeah so regarding the launch and that what kind of um valuation you should consider a launch I mean the advantage of launching lower is that price can go up right and so early buyers uh will be in the positive and they will be happy and supporters if you have a token that's like down only 50% another 50% which means 75% Etc like it's kind of dead and and very hard to recover from that it's a lot better to start small and uh go up

so that's the advantage of starting small the disadvantage of starting small is also if you start at 200m I don't know where on the coin market cap uh page you will launch but it's like in the back uh very much so in the back and so how do you GA attention right how do you how do people even notice that you exist and um yeah that's a disadvantage um and another disadvantage is that I know that um funds L professional investors that invest in the space right if they can buy your token at 200 M it becomes attractive for them to sell it at 800 M

and they have a 4X great uh return managed and so you kind of limit how much um you can go up in terms of absolute value and if you can launch at a billion and you're more in the front of coin Gecko and your price doesn't drop and you have liquid funds that like actually buy into your token and um then then maybe these will enable you to go two three billion from there and you have more Supply to cover your work etc but the big question is just are you a project that can sustain that right so it's kind of like judging the risk right what do you

think is a reasonable price that you can sustain because if you cannot sustain it you're you're in a very weak point but if you start too low that's you you just didn't really maximize what uh what what you could get out of it then so your question Hae uh yeah yeah he missed one about the the supply cap and all that which one is better to have like black cod meaning like you can't meet any more tokens or like I don't think it makes too much of a difference these days like if you have a clear rule around uh how emissions work uh anyways like the the the full

cap as we have seen in big examples like polygon it doesn't mean anything it can be changed so whether you have an open cap in the beginning and steady inflation or you have a full cap and you just inflate the circulating Supply to that full cap I think people don't really care too much about uh these days as long as like the rules around how everything happens are clear okay thank you thank you thank you m so has anyone a question about scalability interoperability toomics uh please go ahead uh you can take this opportunity the last 14 minutes maximum we have to um to ask burning questions

to to Matthew um no no one okaye please the the event was for you sorry I mean this is very important topic for me because I'm trying to finalize my token I me so thank you uh well well if I decide for 100 million for example and I did some private sale I'm currently selling the 40 uh 30% going to 40% of the total Supply and our location maybe 15 to 20% will be on the liquidity pool like as the team and founding will be uh holding so much how do you my Approach is like uh I'm thinking to do something like a like a manual sell orders so to to just uh

control the the supply going out and uh whales like people who manipulate the price can be avoided to uh to get uh more than 5% of the supply because my investors my token Amit is actually uh my initial investors are not allowed to buy more than 3% of the uh coin in that case so we could really prevent uh people from holding that much so so far I manag that but how do you uh suggest me to handle the the the liquidity pool and the private uh the manual sell orders of uh

stuff so so we're going again into uh highly delicate legal areas so I would suggest you talk to your lawyer about uh what you are allowed to do because uh yeah I can't really advise on on on that that just that even if no matter what your token is whether it is considered a security or not there are laws around um what you are allowed to do and Market manipulations exist in all types of different Market and you should definitely try uh to avoid uh manipulating your own Market which which can very much happen right uh that being said you should also choose your market

makers very carefully choose people that you trust and and and also try to supervise them because what we often see is that also these bigger entities uh have their ways in uh how they um yeah ensure that they benefit maximally from from the type of work that they deliver yeah so yeah we we we understand that you cannot you know give too specific details because we are entering some legal areas so yeah that was nice that you you gave some insight still mat um so we have like 10 minutes to go maximum um more questions for Matthew

about toomics interoperability scalability uh or maybe if no one has a question we can just uh have the time like two three minutes for one or two people just to say and to explain what they do so that we just know who's behind those gray screens I will pick for instance uh Edward maybe Edward you want to say what you do just don't answer if you don't want to answer because I don't want to to you know to to put you um and voluntarily uh at the on the stage let's say but if you want to take this opportunity just take it seems like you're off Kristoff you uh opened your camera maybe you want to say

what you do okay just uh very quickly so I am I live in in Geneva and I am um building um um stab coin protocol which is gold packed and uh yeah a decentralized gold packed uh stub coin that's what's the name of the project cyber gold but cyber world we haven't uh advertised it a lot far and do you have a questions uh some questions related to interoperability scalability and toomics not not really uh not really a precise question I interesting to to

listen to the conversation you are in the early Innings of your project seems like yeah we haven't done any uh so this is where you should have the most questions actually building the the team is a is is is already a challenge so okay and uh yeah that that could be an idea for another VC officer was how to be the you know early stage Team without a product running thank you Kristoff maybe Oliver you um unmuted yourself you want to say one or two words about what you are building yeah of course it's a good idea to you know to take some people out of an anity um what we are doing is actually um like your Venture

Studio supporting different kind of projects from the web 3 scene um and yeah I I really appreciate your initiative I think that really makes sense uh to to meet and to get together and um yeah we at the first step we always um rate and and assess projects in order to find out uh if they have a sound Foundation U yeah and with the best of those we we work together that's that's what we do actually maybe Matthew we can we can um have a followup or quick chat how we could potentially collaborate

yeah we will see afterwards how we uh we we make happen those potential connections between participants and guest but but it's really really good and nice initiative congratulations thank you so much um yeah okay so without too much you know uh overextending the talk if we have um if we don't have more questions maybe and N you want to say what you do yes I'm sorry I I should switch my initials I'm Rea aishna hi pleasure actually I'm co-chair of the EMP prise um blockchain working group and I'm so interested into to hear what the Baseline questions is my background is advisory for strategic management and ecosystem building and I'm super interested to see where are

the pain points where are the um overall demands um of especially your working group and also of the participants and we had one question and I wanted to remark that to Zarin at the end of March we have the CVA VB 3 banking Symposium so maybe some of the questions you said about banking stuff and how that can be more implemented in traditional banking could be very relevant for you to go there but I'm just more interested uh listening in and getting inspiration from you guys and I love the form thank you so much for that okay thank you an thank you an okay so let's put a hard cap at 5 to2 CPM and let's have Alexi maybe uh share a few words about what he does so Mery R

uh hello mat nice to see you again after we met in Z at this SEC night of the VCS um so me I'm advising as a as a specialist of capital raising companies in the technology space among a few being in the web free space and it's really you know how to structure s processes how to prepare materials and and reach out to investors I wanted to rebound one thing you said Matthew a bit earlier on tokenomics specifically where you talked about you know how it's launched and basically the fact that you can't really get retail to to bite into it uh you as a VC do you still consider investing into newly launched tokens or

uh do you rather focus on you know traditional Equity like instruments uh so yeah we we have a mandate to invest in already launched tokens I I mean like 80% of the private Investments that we do so so we mainly invest at preed um don't have tokens yet but they will launch tokens later down the road so in 80% of the cases we expect the company that we invest in at preed to launch a token later just based on what type of product they are building however we have also reserved around 20% of the fund um to buy in public markets uh why do we do that because um depending on Loot on where

the market is at we see that it is not very rational and so we sometimes have information uh that you know some company raised at let's just say 100 m their last round uh before the token launched and they have runway for three years and then the token launches and it's a bad Market environment and it trades at 30 million and or 50 million so you can buy at like a 50% discount with no look up to what institutional larger investors have bought at before we see this pretty regularly and if you strongly believe in the team and you know they're working on it they're well funded and you like the product so on it

can make sense to invest in these types of tokens highly uh risky you need to do your DD um but especially for us as a fund which is pretty small uh and and therefore can enter markets which are also not very liquid uh this this makes sense uh and and yeah we still do that super thank you uh so much uh for this question Al and the answer matth okay so I guess we are uh up unless there is one last question but I don't want don't want to force anyone to ask a questions those questions should be real so um I guess we're good so uh we will uh try to contact you after this event

participants dear participants to to get your your feedback because we want to improve this format we already see what could be improved but um it was very much a enjoyable as a moment in my opinion so thank you so much mat for the time for your insights and for the the way you openly discussed with with the audience and thank you very much to the participant for the questions suggestion I don't know maybe you want to keep it private not recorded So maybe people talk more openly but if it is if it is quite fast please go ahead I no it wasn't the question I was just saying maybe it's a very quick suggestion say uh I mean unless you want to keep the sessions private people talk

more openly maybe some parts can be recorded some answers Etc so people you can share to your listen people can refer to it you know grow the network spread the word and is useful information would not be lost yeah it's just an idea yeah it's a good suggestion because this is what we want to do we want to you know to increase interactions and engagement and have more people get together and nurture this EOS this you know this was interesting whatever super yeah thank you for the feedback Zin okay so anyone now everyone is free to go uh thank you so much Matthew again and uh let's uh check uh together soon for the next um VC office

hour which will happen in about let's say three to five weeks thank you so much everyone have a good day have a good afternoon have a good morning bye everyone