The Solana Outage, Taproot Wizards NFTs and Ethereum's Future Post Upgrade

Transcript

one of the improvements that uh is going to come with the dun is Proto D sharding 4844 so it's going to include uh another type of the transaction uh that's going to be possible once the upgrades is done uh and that type of transaction is going to allow for much larger input uh and must much more cost effici icient uh input uh comparing to what's been the case so far and who's going to benefit from it the most uh are not going to be the end users of the application but it's mostly going to be uh Layer Two networks uh that uh uh need to submit uh all of the

data to the ethereum uh in order to be in order to extract the the security of the layer one network in this case ethereum in it in the numbers wise what's that going to allow is a 10 times cheaper way of uh putting large amounts of data on the etherium layer one network and consequentially that's going to enable much cheaper transaction on layer Layer Two Network which is something that uh we've been all waiting for uh since I would say 2017 once the gas prices uh uh spiked significantly hello and welcome to the protocol

podcast I'm Brad C here with my co-host Margot nykerk Sam kastler is uh on his way out uh I think to meet Danny Nelson at The salana Hacker House like as we speak in Utah but um anyway we do have a co- a guest co-host today Neisha rosovich uh who is the senior vice president for engineering at tenderly which is um a a essentially a full stack infrastructure platform uh are they kind of like

Alchemy Nisha or not really similar with some addition uh Dev tooling stuff uh uh and uh some other infrastructure components that Alchemy doesn't have got it well we're super happy uh we're gonna talk have a cool conversation about ethereum uh they had their um Denon upgrade on the heski test net this morning so we're going to key off of that which Margo covered um and we're going to dive right into some uh news stories first and talk about those and then we'll come back uh you know and uh interview Neisha at the end um in our second uh protocol Village

segment so all right with that let's Dive Right In uh first please don't forget to subscribe to our weekly newslet the protocol on coindesk.com Margo you probably rolling your eyes every time I say that but uh oh we need subscribers we need subscribers we we thank you to the subscribers already who follow us but you know the more the merrier yes it is the more the mar it's pretty good I mean we work pretty hard on it uh but anyway all right first story uh salana backup following major five hour outage uh I wrote about this for the protocol newsletter speaking of which uh today it was pretty interesting uh I don't know

Margot did you have any quick thoughts on this one yeah I mean I guess salana is on a a yearly basis to have an outage right it was like coming up on its year anniversary of running smoothly and it just didn't make it I think it was like February 25th right so three weeks but ever since like 2021 I believe there's been an outage so I guess it's done for 20124 right like maybe the next one is 2025 but was offline for five hours and I think just given a there's been a lot of news around in salana right it's sort of had like a revamp after its sort of downfall following the SPF FTX out it's been one of the more buzzing and growing

communities with developers so um that came away like that I don't know there was some pretty big news about it but uh what do you guys think Neisha you have any thoughts on this one uh well uh salana thens to uh push things to the extreme uh when it comes to the number of transactions uh I like that they are experimenting but with that comes the the price of uh outage from here and there well we're really looking forward to this one-year anniversary I mean I even read about it in coinbase institutional uh report was just on Friday they were talking about how this thing was coming up and so all eyes were

on them and it was just you know they it's like they were running the marathon and they tripped right as they were getting up there so I think it's especially embarrassing for them well also you know I I want to highlight also Dan had wrote a really great piece um about salana and the title of it was can we stop pretending like it's still in beta right because the like the name of the chain is actually like main at beta at this point like it's the fifth largest tvl like I said there's a whole bunch of like buzzing developments happening on it there was a store that opened up in New York City I mean like you know it's like one of the biggest change and so um sort of referring to it as beta seems kind of like obscure at

this point you know to Nia's point I think the salana ethereum competition is heating up again and and I saw a tweet or post on X at this point that that showed that you know ethereum's tackling fees which I guess we'll get into later right when we talk about Proto charting and salana is tackling like security and and and outages like this so this just goes to show like these narratives that these chains are built on right Solano was supposed to be the cheaper chain compared to ethereum they're both still dealing with these problems that won't be resolved immediately and we're going to get more hiccups in the future so I mean I also really like Dan Coon's piece uh which by the way the Denon is upgrade is not named after

Dan um you know I mean this idea of beta I mean in some ways this shows that it is actually in beta I mean and to your point you know all these things are in beta you know another take on that would be you know that salana is the only one that's being honest that yeah this stuff's all in beta I don't know what what do you think about that no neish so that's an interesting thing um I would say that uh it uh uh right now ethereum is more risk averse when it comes to shipping new things which I think uh um they want to because I mainly they want to keep the chain up the whole time uh which I get it uh of course that comes at the price

of uh uh slower slower building uh slower uh uh uh less changes on the protocol level which I think are important for the uh Mass adoption of the blockchains uh on the other hand as Margaret me mentioned uh salana is now tackling the security side of the things uh and it feels like uh uh Android and iPhone uh uh 10 years ago when where now we're like there there there's almost no difference between uh the two softwares fasting I love that comparison and I I agree it's you know I I hear what you're saying that this is all sort of in beta but salana has a big enough pres presence to sort of like in my opinion

not call itself beta anymore I mean polygon zkm is still technically main net beta right like that's the name of that and N ckms are more susceptible to be calling beta because it's such a new technology right I guess that's all up for debate anyway all right well that is uh pretty uh I mean it's to serious story but it is also uh somewhat entertaining but all right let's move on to our next one here um enan lay insane you know Sam Kesler who not with who is not here today he wrote this story on Monday night when they lifted the cap you know Ian layer the big uh reaking protocol and you know people knew it was going to be a big deal but

all of a sudden it seems like it's a huge deal um they lifted their Cap all of a sudden money you know when he wrote this story it sorted from like two billion to three billion and now there's like four billion at TBL we should back it up a little bit for the listeners that are not entirely sure or don't completely understand reaking but basically it's this new way to earn rewards to earn yield by taking your staked eth or your liquid staking tokens and locking that into igen layer and in some way getting some kind of reward by securing uh other protocols and other daps or they call them avss um actively validated Services what's I don't remember what they not autonomous

valid AC validated services that are built on igen layer and ordering some kind of reward for that this is sort of emerged as this new ecosystem in ethereum um and maybe it's an entirely new separate ecosystem from ethereum even though it sort of uses the ethereum as the base but like you said it's it's you know this cap was lifted originally there was a cap put on igen layer so that there would be like a more they claimed it was like a way to decentralize the the protocol and make sure that these Stak tokens had like big a bit more of equal share if I'm correct and now they lifted the cap like they've done previously because of um what they claimed as like a surged increased interest or increased demand I think was

the word they used I don't remember verbatim but something like that and so this is sort of I think awoken us to a whole new ecosystem of what does it mean to restake what are the risks like what are the rewards like is this really something that is necessary in our in this industry or is this just another way for like you know to earn higher yields and yeah I mean vitalic the co-founder the co-founder of ethereum has written about it and has stated sort of his I guess concerns with with reaking but yeah this has brought I I like like I've said I don't think this is the last time we're going to be talking about Igan layer but anyway NOOA what do you have to say I think you have probably some more insights into this

since you're you know an ethereum expert something that's really interesting to me is that whenever certain protocol changes or upgrades occur in this case it was the merge and the following uh upgrade that allowed for the withdrawals uh these changes are the things that uh uh basically allowed reaking so for me what is very interesting is that uh when these upgrades to the protocol level occur uh there are so much potential uh in the all consequential pieces of the of the blockchain uh uh and after the protocol we have the infrastructure and then after that there are developers who

are building uh on top of these protocols and leveraging the infrastructure and then in the end we all give it out to the users uh to test out and to see if there is a product Market fit there or no but yeah the interesting thing is that these changes all ow for so much to happen in the blockchain space I wonder if you can sort of explain because you know the the positives of this basically sound like it's like the rewards right it's the yield it's the extra earning yields but maybe you know for our listeners who might not know maybe you can explain sort of what it is that are the risks associated with this I'm thinking more particularly like the security risk um if there are any in your opinion so I'm not an expert on the

financial things I I usually just look at the code the code uh uh seems to be there but again I'm not sure if this is uh uh this is to me it's either a a road to uh uh something that occur in 2008 in the housing market or something much bigger and uh much better than that uh I'm not I'm I'm not Financial I'm curious you know I mean Neisha what about you know from you know at tenderly um are there some of these avss are they coming to you you know as clients uh for development work or anything how does

maybe like what are you seeing in your business so what we mostly who are mostly our users and who are we catering are usually the developers uh who are building uh applications on ethereum or some other layer 2 network uh so we help them uh uh we uh uh enable them to work in an isolated environments that boost their productivity allow them to uh more efficiently debug and analyze their smart contracts so those would be mostly the the the users that we uh cater developers got it okay yeah I mean we had Riad wabby from cubis last week and he was talking about just how you know

um it opens up well I mean that that number one you know the business of staking and I guess now staking is just becoming theoretically more institutional even though you know a lot of this Margo I think a lot of you talk about the yield a lot of this is like airdrop farming too right yeah I mean I think a lot of it is still very you know we talk about institutional I think this is very dgen for the moment you know we're not seeing like a JP Morgan or Black Rock like you know but maybe maybe you know we're talking about Igan leer maybe Igan da is something that you know the data availability thing is something that will appeal to to some more of the masses but this is still very like Crypton native at this point I mean Ian

layer Ian layer hasn't gone live with its mainnet right there's a lot locked into this and a lot of hype for something that isn't fully live at this moment right so on the other hand like a lot of these avss are quote unquote theoretically legit projects right I mean they're they're you know queuing up to do real I mean the whole point is it's not a bad concept you know it's just like um you know you're you're a shopping mall and you're you know you need some security you may you know employ your own security or you may hire a company to provide security right like that's the concept here but so it's not the whole the concept is not terrible but

yeah it's it seems like it's just not totally clear how it's going to play out yeah I I love the analogy that NAA made about the 2008 Market that this is either completely going to collapse or this is going to um surprise us and you know I'm not want to predict anything or or agree or disagree but before we got on this call I will say that Brad and I were saying that I wonder if this is going to you know like overload the network which is some of the fear that vitalic has void the validators are gonna have you know too much of a a load put on them so this is this is something that we're going to be talking way more about I think um and and we're going to be following I think all the new projects that are coming out of uh

what's being built on top of Igan layer I don't think we're done talking about raking in this moment this is to come as they say I mean as enan Lay's uh tvl ticks up as we're speaking is that five now I don't know but uh all right let's see uh we had one more topic we were going to try to hit here before we go to the break and this was a story that Jamie Crawley and I have been covering and just CU it's been tons of fun which is the uh the tap rot Wizards debut uh sale of their you know ordinals inscriptions project uh Quantum cats this is a project they came out last year they basically started this company

to sell you know these ordinals and they raised $7.5 million for the project and it worked last Monday they came on and they had this minting and they had built their own website apparently and it was a complete disaster like the the website didn't work and everybody was you know posting all these screenshots in the Discord about how they couldn't get their cats um and then they delayed it and they delayed it they kept delaying it they delayed it till Monday and then they sold him out like you know and they raised like $13 million uh I don't know what y'all have any thoughts on this I don't have any particular smart thoughts on this this automatically just made me

think of the Taylor Swift like tickets you know how like The Ticket Master like wasn't working everyone wanted those tickets and then boom it sold out so I don't know maybe you know this is not a very smart comparison but maybe this project is in its Taylor Swift era I don't know but you know I think this is sort of what we've probably mentioned in previous podcasts that this is I think is highlighting sort of that there's development happening on bitcoin you know from from my perspective um when you cover ethereum you don't really think that much about like all the developments that are happening on bitcoin Bitcoin is just sort of this digital standard of gold right and and untouched um but um I'm always like Keen to hear that you know there's um that

there's now nfts on bitcoin and there's all this craze right we're not seeing that nft craz as much on ethereum but I don't know any other thoughts now bisha I mean you're mainly ethereum focused right but I mean do you have any thoughts on this uh story I I I heard about ordinal last week and uh unfortunately I haven't had the time to check check it out yeah I love that there's some development going on on bitcoin Network I think that it's going to tremendously uh uh uh allow some of the additional use cases rather than the the standard one for the Bitcoin Network yeah that's really interesting I mean that is you know and that absolutely is the narrative these days is um you know

Bitcoin L2 development and uh if we're going to see you know a lot of activity I mean there are tons of projects I mean I I'm you know doing the protocol Village column I get tons of submissions we had a couple in the newsletter today of these kind of like you know projects on top of Bitcoin defy or whatever you know I wanted to ask Brad you know because you you've been following this stuff more closely but I'm wondering are like you you've talked to a bunch of the developers or figures in this scene you know are they taking note of what's happening on a like is this sort of like oh look like there's been this this road map they've created there all these layer twos they're scaling the blockchain they have nfts like what like where are they getting I

don't want to say inspiration because it's not you know it's more technical than artistic but are they sort of paying attention to the development that's happening on ethereum and wondering what they can do to improve Bitcoin like where does that intersection sort of fall I mean I think everything they're doing is basically just copying ethereum okay you know you know I mean hon honestly that's kind of what it is they're just trying to they're just stealing that Playbook that ethereum has developed you know ethereum went off and did its thing and now they want it you know or it's or people are figuring out okay we want to build on bitcoin and it's just you know the same stuff that's on a theorum in a lot of cases I mean I don't know if I can do this but you know to quote another podcast quoting another person I was

just listening to a podcast um yesterday the uh oh Peter cormax uh Bitcoin uh podcast uh uh what Bitcoin did and he was saying you know he had had I didn't it's here the original but he had had Pete Rizzo who's the former editor and chief of co co yeah and and that he was saying you know that you know his his point was just that um everything that you know happened off of Bitcoin would eventually come back to bitcoin so I don't know there's obviously you know lots of narratives about that sort of inevitability but you know that's kind of the bitcoiner view if that answers your question Margo yeah know I'm

wondering if Bitcoin devs would admit that they're just copying and pasting what's going on on ethereum I don't know there's no quickly to say that but but you know that would be interesting to get that on the record so maybe we should get someone a Bitcoin down on here all right um can you can try to nail that down Margo you have the contacts not me but I'll ask the question I'm happy to okay all right uh all right we're going to take a break when we come back we're going to we're going to be hitting Nebo Isa we're going to be hitting it with a hard question calling all developers score a consensus 2024 developer pass for just $19 but Act Fast only a limited number

of these passes are available you may have heard that consensus ain't for devs but here's why you're wrong consensus is the only place you can fully immerse your yourself in a multi-chain environment and learn directly from 20 plus chains including arbitrum chain link salana and more enjoy three days of intensive learning with technical talks 40 plus expert speakers and 20 plus in-depth workshops including dedicated half days for ethereum and Bitcoin and three full days of programming on our protocol Village stage consensus 2024 is happening May 29th through 31st in Boston Texas don't miss your chance to

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know NE WEA why don't you just tell us a little bit about tenderly yeah sure um so tenderly is a project that started uh some five years ago uh with were just a couple of uh friends uh that were going to blockchain heatons and we came to realization that it takes takes us much longer to develop things on the blockchain so we came with the idea to build some of the development productivity tooling for us at that point to uh help us win more hackathons um after some times we realized that uh these tools can be used not just just by us but it that it makes sense uh for

everyone in the uh uh blockchain ecosystem to uh uh have it available uh in order to be more productive uh and after some uh and after a few years of development uh uh and um trying to uh uh find some of the best use cases trying to land the product Market fit uh we we we become uh something that we call is a full stack infrastructure provid that helps uh developers be uh more productive more efficient when they are building smart contracts ensuring that they are secure uh uh optimized and uh once they are in production that they

can seamlessly scale with the number of users and uh when the adoption of these applications come and just to help Orient people maybe a little bit I I was wondering if you could just you know tell us what is like the most common thing that you do for a client and just you know what do they come what do they need you for and then what do you do for them and and how long does it take and I don't know if you can tell us kind of like how much they pay for that but like how does that you know just sort of what's your most common thing that you're doing sure uh so we usually cater to the some of the bigger teams in the space but not just bigger uh some of the developer enthusiasts but when we take

the case of of a theme in the ethereum ecosystem that is developing either on ethereum Manet or some other layer 2 network uh they usually uh want to uh ship uh uh decentralized application to the network and what they usually do is they spin off uh isolated environments uh where they test out their smart contracts uh where they integrate with the their front ends uh where they debug uh once the once they find some of the errors in the in the smart contracts uh then further down the road they usually rely on our tooling to

optimize uh smart contracts to save on gas because uh that ends up uh uh uh saving uh uh dollars uh of their users um then once they are done with the development they usually uh uh start leveraging some of the infrastructure stuff that we have so a couple of things that they usually uh uh end up leveraging are the simulations so uh everybody knows that uh uh um once you send a transaction on the network there's usually uh uh no a way of cancelling it uh so uh in that sense uh users can have a sneak preview of what's going to happen before uh that

transaction hits the blockchain uh giving them more context of what's to come if they execute it and of course uh uh uh for the access to the blockchain technology they usually you leverage our no Des a service offering uh sort of to uh um help them uh um Leverage The tooling that we have in total okay that is really great uh Neisha thank you um all right well so we're going to talk you know I think we we discussed we're going to talk about you know the the Denon upgrade and kind of what that means and Margo there was a you know there was some news on that today do you want to just give a quick quick summary

of what happened this morning yeah sure so um you know the dankun upgrade we we've talked about a bunch on here um when had its final test today on the heski heski I should say uh test net um so we're gearing up towards main net which is really exciting I think you know they're going to decide tomorrow morning when to Ink in a date but by the time this airs that all been decided so um you know check back on your Twitter and your devs to find out when it happens because you know we won't know in this very moment but um but be on next week's podcast yeah well there might be another news by next week's podcast so I can't guarantee that but but um but yeah so this has been uh this

has been a long time coming but uh I wonder n bua maybe you can talk a little bit explain to us a little bit out or to the listeners um like what this means for ethereum users L2 users um once D like once Proto dang sharding which is you know part of that Danon or maybe first explain like a brief explainer what Proto dang sharding is and what that means for users uh on ethereum and on L2 once that goes lives sure so one of the one of the improvements that is going to come with the dun is Proto D sharding or ape for uh uh 4844 so it's going to include uh another type of the

transaction uh that's going to be possible once the upgrades is done uh and that type of transaction is going to allow for much larger input uh and must must more cost-efficient uh input uh comparing to what's been the case so far um and who's going to benefit from it the most uh are not going to be the end users of the application but it's mostly going to be uh Layer Two networks uh that uh uh need to submit uh all of the data to the ethereum uh in order to be in order to extract the the security of the layer one network in this case

ethereum in it um and what what's that in the numbers wise what's that going to allow is uh 10 times cheaper way of uh putting large amounts of data on the ethereum layer one network and consequentially that's going to enable much cheaper transactional layer layer to network which is something that uh we've been all waiting for uh since I would say 2017 once the gas prices uh spiked significantly yeah yeah I think that's a really you know I think that was a great way of sort of framing like step by step what that's going to happen that like it's sort of an indirect you know consequence of this is that these transactions on layer twos are going to

be cheaper as a result of that like inner mechanism I wonder you know there's been a lot of emphasis um by vitalic by the devs to you know push for layer Twos for for all this building on top of ethereum and now it's going to be cheaper you know to transact on layer twos do you wonder if there's going you know I I think I've seen also a narrative change a little bit about trying to grab some of those us users back to layer ones or back to the layer one to ethereum because there has this been this push to go to the rollups um I wonder you know after 4844 is there going to be a more intense competition in terms of like transacting on uh or activity on a layer two like a

you know polygon ZK evm like an arbitrum like an an optimism um versus I guess I'm just wondering like will there be some kind of loss in activity on ethereum as as a result of this cheaper mechanism for the layer twos uh well one thing there is that we are like uh going away from the monolithic blockchain into the modar blockchain uh and we've been all trying to solve this uh scalability problem that I think is one of the main reason why blockchain is not uh hitting the mass adoption I think that uh this is just one of the bottlenecks that we uh have uh uh at this point uh Assa uh that

that's been bugging us for I would say six seven years now and uh once we solve that there are certainly going to be some other issues uh I would definitely say that uh uh there's most likely going to be a battle of uh which layer two uh is the most popular I would also I also think that there's um some of the traffic uh uh that's going right now on the E L1 is going to move to the uh rollup as a service networks that have been spun up sure but yeah uh uh I definitely think that uh uh one of the issues is going to be solving liquidity uh how all of these blockchains are

going to uh communicate uh so some way of solving the the cross chain communication um but yeah uh um I think overall uh uh in two or three years we're going to see most likely four to five predominant L2 Solutions and then uh others will most likely be layer three or layer four Etc and I just want to follow up real quick because you you brought up the L2 uh you know battle which I I've been following very closely and I and I love that story um but you know on the put you on the spot like who do you think is going to win that uh I'm not sure uh I I I can say I which technology is more most likely

going to win in the future uh and that's most likely going to be the zero knowledge rups uh so that's the easy question that I can answer I don't know well polygon matter lab scroll if you're listening yeah be watching well okay um that's really interesting uh both of you uh well all right so Neisha I'm curious you know I was reading a post from near okay uh and you know near is is sort of pivoting to you know find its own

strategy and this post was about near da okay and so and and it had a table comparing ethereum currently ethereum post Pro d sharding uh which is kind of a you know long word uh and then you know versus Celestia da and versus near da and the point of the thing I mean was obviously that near da was they were saying it was going to be the cheapest and the fastest but I mean the point being

that ethereum's finally coming out with this Proto D sharding and the question is is it already obsolete I I mean I'm wondering what you think about that so the Proto d sharding uh is just the first step uh to a full dun sharding yeah uh so uh this is this is that sorry go ahead um this is just ethereum being extremely risk averse uh uh in taking very slow steps uh because they're aware that if a bug uh in the specification or a bug in some of the major clients uh uh would happened uh that would uh have

catastrophic consequences uh so I would say that like uh uh them taking things slow and just comparing the the Proto down Charing uh uh costs uh um I would say that uh the that's just the first version uh uh in the future we are yet to see the full D sharding which is hopefully going to decrease the costs uh uh by 100x uh and I'm sure that the the the folks uh working at the ethereum foundation or uh uh um some other researchers are going to come up with an even better ideas in the future um so yeah okay that's really interesting I

mean I think that's a good point um well you know I guess as we see this drop in the cost of store of data storage right uh that's what we're talking about how much extra development does that spawn you know how is that is that going to lead to an explosion in l2s or you know that that even more so than we've already seen so I would say that initially after every protocol upgrade uh there's going to be a time usually three to 12 months where uh uh there's going to come out that some new infrastructure component some new tooling is going to come out that is

going to Sparkle some of the the ideas that devs in the ethereum ecosystem have uh similar to Egan layer I would say and we're yet to see what how devs are going to utilize all of that uh so I would say that uh I'm not sure but I'm really uh uh eager uh uh uh about this upgrade especially as it so finally solves one of the biggest things points uh that's been going around in the ethereum ecosystem and not just ethereum but the whole blockchain space I wonder you know I was thinking about what you were saying just earlier now about how ethereum developers are extremely risk averse and they're they're very slow in the implementation

of making this cheaper and terms of making this more scalable in terms of you know sort of doing like solving these problems that are supposedly going to bring on more people um but I'm wondering are they going too slow you know like it's it's great that they're that they understand that that there's this gigantic Network been built on top of it and that there's no downtime they cannot have downtime is like their man Mantra right but you know blockchain goes through these waves and every time you know I feel like we're on a wave back up after this bare Market if we want to say that we're coming out of a bare Market but you know with that comes more blockchain adoption more users more higher trans C fees probably right so

we're finally hitting Proto dang sharding but dang sharding and then full sharding is like I don't want to say decades away but it feels like light years away and blockchain years right so so like on the one hand it is risk averse but on the other hand with anticipating that blockchain is only going to get more and more usable by people is it too slow so I would say for the layer one most likely know uh and uh uh what what we can expect is that layer twos are going to uh develop much faster in the future so what I suspect is that we're going to have uh arbitrum optimism zking

polygon Z KVM that are going to leverage some of the uh uh new technology that they think uh uh uh uh should be used by the developers so what I'm thinking and uh uh there is that in the future uh we're most likely uh uh going to see much more Layer Two solution that are uh uh experimenting that they're trying something new uh which I think is a great way of kind of balancing the the risk overs that the ethereum layer one is taking mhm it's really interesting yeah yeah well I think uh we should probably wrap it up there um thank you for the fascinating uh conversation uh neb

and Margo thanks for the for the really interesting questions and um Michelle thanks to Michelle our producer keeping us on track exactly as always big shout out to to Neisha rosovich uh from tenderly joining us uh from Serbia and that is a wrap for this week's uh the protocol podcast um thank you for listening if you have any questions about any stories or comments please reach out to us at podcasts coindesk.com subject lineth protocol you can listen to US Weekly on coindesk podcast Network or wherever you get your

podcasts also please subscribe to our Weekly Newsletter the protocol on coindesk.com thank you and see you next week