Shuyao Kong on Why MegaETH Is the Only Option for Onchain Finance

Transcript

I am live here with Shreya Kang of Mega ETH. Shreya, welcome to the show. Welcome to the tower. Great to see you again here in New York, your favorite city in the world or not? Absolutely. Nothing compares with New York. Nice. Well, it's good to have you. >> as mentioned, yeah. Yes. Yes. Uh with the AI doomers. >> [laughter] >> Exactly. >> Exactly. Well, good to have you. It's been a while. It's been maybe 6 8 months since since you've been on the show and obviously you guys have launched the mainnet. You guys have gotten products out there, apps out there. So, yeah, catch me up. What what's been the last 6 months like and then let's talk about what happened after mainnet. Yeah, absolutely. So, I think the biggest news is the mainnet went live after working

on it for 3 years, believe it or not. Uh blockchains are actually indeed really difficult to build. Um and then setting up the infrastructure around the chain has also been very painful. Uh but luckily, I think I'm just really relieved that the chain is live. It's really really freaking fast as we promised. Nothing has broken. Uh and every promise we've given to the community and investor about technology has come to fruition. So, I'm just really happy about it.

Um there are things that concerns me as well. Uh as most people know, we we launched the chain and we started the KPI base TG E and most of our efforts are focusing on having a very healthy sustainable chain economics via the apps, via the stable coin USDM. Um so, the focus for the entire team is to make sure that the apps are going live. They're going live with good quality. They're going live with good adoption.

Uh I think yesterday the Bricks team came on the show, yeah. Um so, we have been working tirelessly and in secret of a lot of new primitive. Uh I think Bricks represent one of them. Uh working with them to make sure that they are going live with us has been uh our focus. Yeah. Yeah, awesome. So, curious then like it's been about 2 months. What are I know you kind of touched on a bit, but maybe a bit more concretely, what are some of the things that you've been most positive about post mainnet? And then as you said, some of the kind of things that that you guys are trying to work on, improve as you just shipping apps. Talk to me about the pros and cons here and let's get into

some of the nuances. Yeah. Uh the positive is, you know, we continue to welcome more new builders. Okay. It's amazing, guys. People say like, oh, you know, everybody pivoted to to AI. It's not true. Uh last night, so every time I'm in town, sometimes when I'm not in town, we have this Mega Mafia hangout. >> Yeah. Uh we go to one of our builders' rooftop and, you know, we grab Linda Street pizza, grab a beer. And just chat and talk about life, talk about work. And yesterday we had a really good turnout. We have new builders coming in.

Um the dream team, for example, they're building a option protocol, but it's extremely retail friendly. Um if you use the app, you don't really need to understand option in order to trade. So, I'm continuously impressed by the type of builders we're able to attract. I think partly it's because the chain is indeed really performant. I think partly because I think Mega has demonstrated that we walk the talk. Yeah. >> Right? We said we're community focused. We've done a bunch of um you know, investment rounds that targeting retail communities.

Um you know, we said the chain is fast and chain turned out to be really fast. We did a stress test last year, which is, you know, 40K TPS continuous blasting the chain and it worked beautifully. Um I think lastly is I believe that we're a chain with a bit of more aesthetics and attitude. Um trying to stay out of the typical, you know, crypto UI UX. Um so, yeah, I'm been very positive surprised. Had a great time hangout with the builders. I think they um they teach me more than I teach them. Uh yeah, because they are expert in their area. Right. And they come to you and they trust their entire product on your platform. They want you to understand their unique value proposition, their growth market. So, I'm now forced

dive really deep into different sectors. Really fun. Um And the things that I would say a bit challenging and indeed it's, you know, I lose sleep over this is, you know, apps is our biggest focus, but every app has their own challenge. And there's very little that I can go and and fix it for them. Um [snorts] so, the Bricks guy, give another example, they were supposed to launch with us a month ago. However, they have to go through a lot of paperwork in Turkey with the central banks, etc. And it requires humongous amount of interpersonal relationship and this type of things take time.

Um so, I think my job is to make sure that everything is settled for them and whenever they're ready, we're ready there for them. So, it's a bit of coordination that has been taking a lot of time. Yeah. You know, I feel like the the tides have shifted consistently throughout Mega ETH's kind of life cycle pre-chain, post-chain. Like it's just constantly shifting. Like you guys are operating in a in a a variety of different like market environments, also um market demand on-chain being very active, being slower, sentiments, infrastructure, all these different components. I mean, I've lived through them with you. Um I'm just curious like how your

your perspective has changed on like what type of applications are going to power a lot of the future value on Mega ETH in general in the on-chain world, right? Like I think we have clear categories of perps, tokenized assets or tokenization, vaults are kind of being a more institutionally led conversation, stable coins. Right? They're kind of like these basic four, but you guys are very much like expanded outside of just purely like the basic four. But I'm curious like how have you thought about more like what like just generally, what's your viewpoint on the types of applications that on-chain enables and kind of just curious how that's evolved.

We are um user experience maxi. Okay. Period. We believe that users want to use different primitives. It's probably not that hard to build a primitive in 2026. But it's really hard to build a good user experience for normies. That's what we believe in. Uh we also believe in non-copy pasta. I am very vocal about it. >> [laughter] >> I think for the last 3 years, no matter what is bull market or bear market, if the product is very um not so unique, I am always very blunt and straightforward and sometimes I would tell builders is like, please go build somewhere else because you're not going to get much support from here. Um

so, from our perspective, I see on-chain finance, whether it's pure DeFi, you know, sometimes we call it arcade finance or gamified experiences, I see them as different a combination of different layers. Okay. Um I don't believe that you need one product that serves both institution, retail, whales, and dolphin. I don't think that's the case. What I think you an ecosystem needs is really good like DEX infrastructure. And then you want builders to build unique experiences on top of it. I'll give you an example.

So, I call it layered. >> Yeah. Uh we have a DEX called World Market. It is the most freaking Cypherpunk DEX you could ever find. That it has no backend. Like I kid you not. Like there's no one can it's like no one control that DEX, right? Which I think is original ethos of crypto for those who kind of forgot. Um so, that is an infrastructure and the retail experience using that that's really isn't the best. However, we have another team called hit.one. Um founder was the first growth hire of Polymarket. Uh he built hit.one on top of World, which translates a perp DEX into a unique experience. Um so, that is a layer we're looking for. Another

example would be Bricks, right? So, they're bringing Turkish lira to carry trade. But [snorts] in order to short try, you can go to World to short it. And then you can go to Avon, a lending protocol. So, what you're seeing is um what I think is, you know, people promised in um DeFi Lego in 2021. And I think it justifies the existence of general purpose blockchain. Yeah. If you don't have layered primitives, I think you should build app chain. You should not build on top of a you should not collocate and share block space. So, to answer your question, we want non-copy pasta, we want primitives that leverage each other. We believe in extreme

on-chain applications. Yeah. So, Legend Trade they're a complete separate application. They just did this event in New York the other day. I think it was yesterday. And they had like this boxing ring and they had all these traders trading for like a couple hours on perps, maximizing and I mean, they did like this whole competition around it. Are are you still a big bull in like this like gamified experiences on chain for like speculative perp trading or just like trading in general on chain? Like do you are you still firmly in the camp that like this type of enablement of taking something like trading, which is like very like quant heavy, it can be very nerdy, it can be very difficult and making it like into like this gamified

experience, is that still part of the part of the thesis? Oh, 100%. I mean, Ryan ate money there. They're all homies. >> Yeah, cool. >> Uh they're all good friends and um I think the world is changing, Andy. It is. The world is changing. The gamification of everything is non-stoppable. I think the competition to provide gamified experience is also non-stoppable. Yeah. Um so it's very much and we're seeing people coming on Mega for that experience because of the real-timeness of the blockchain. You legit don't have latency when you build these experiences on Mega. And you can never do that on another layer one blockchain. I'll emphasize it one more time. The It's the beautiful thing about Mega is is the technology actually works to deliver web two user experiences. You

just You can't do it anywhere else. Yeah. Yeah. Um I'm curious if you're if you regret launching the KPIs. Oh, no. Absolutely not. No. I am so happy I did. >> Cuz we're getting close here. Well, what it's six apps I I I I think are six apps, 100 million TVL of USDM, and there's one other and it's I think the six apps is getting quite close now. Is Is that correct? Yeah, so six apps and then uh 100 million TVL, then there's apps revenue. The apps revenue is tied to the apps launching.

So if the apps is not launched, then there's no revenue. So that is an awkward KPI, I would say. Um I am extremely um how to say I I've never even thought about regretting that, to be honest. It's a question, yes. But I want to explain our rational, right? The rational was very simple. Is you want to have In order to justify the existence of Mega, like why does Mega deserve to exist? Mm. We deserve to exist because there's Mega GDP. There's economic activity, and there are unique things to do for people.

If we can't meet certain bars, certain quality, we do not deserve to exist. Yeah. And I want to show that to the world because we have this culture of co-building, and I think it's kind of bold, honestly. It requires some guts to do that. >> Yeah. And I'm all game for this. >> Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Um so stablecoin growth has been somewhat slow. Why? What's the What's What's going on there? Yeah, um stablecoin growth is strictly tied to the DeFi apps. So if the DeFi apps is not there, then there's no stablecoin. So um everything comes down to application or user experience.

>> Yeah. Nothing else matters. Forget about your you know, fancy blocks or infrastructure. If the apps are there, money will come. Yeah. Yeah yeah. No, I mean, the entire chain ecosystem is changing. I think like this this whole institutional institutionalization of this industry is also changing. Kind of like zooming out more holistically here, how would you how would you describe the state of something like Omega E, something like an on-chain ecosystem compared to like the NYSE is like we want to launch our own block space or like these large institutions are like, "Oh, we want to you know, build on

Canton." Like like there's just like this really weird dynamic where it's like there's almost like these bifurcated worlds growing about. Um you guys being one of the leaders in kind of the more on-chain native world, curious like your perception on the splitting and then perhaps your thoughts on is Mega E like ready to be an institutional chain? Like Like what What does that even mean? Exactly. What does it even mean to be an institutional chain? Um it's a very different game. And it's different muscles. It requires different your diff your views of the world.

>> Yeah. Um at the end of the day, we serve our builders, and our builders tend to be those who want to provide retail user experiences. >> Yeah. Um whether that touch upon institution is their decision. Right. >> my decision. Um if, you know, Mega become the quote unquote, you know, selling ourselves as back end to NYSE, uh it's a very different world we're envisioning, and that is not um historically the product market fit we're seeing. Um now, do I think that it's either or?

I don't think it's either or. I don't think you have to choose. I think what Hyperliquid has demonstrated is if you have enough liquidity retail order flow, you have enough traction, the institutions will come. Yeah. If you do the right thing, people will come and congregate around you. Yeah. So you don't think that the that the industry has lost its soul a bit with with all of this? You know, cuz I I I know you're a pretty strong believer in kind of some of the core ethos of what we're doing here. You guys have built Mega in a very opinionated way. Which actually before we get to that, you guys took a lot of flak for building Mega E in like this like we're going to build this really beefy sequencer. We're We're going to optimize for throughput in an era of the industry where like

people are talking more about decentralizing their sequencers than they were about their first thousand users. And I And I mean that sincerely. Hyperliquid came out and clearly showed build a product, don't give a damn really about where your nodes are, get a lot of traction, figure it out. Right? You guys took a similar approach. In hindsight, like do you do you believe it was the right approach? Um we're very different from Hyperliquid. Yeah. >> Yeah. Um [snorts] it's all first principle. What's the first principle? The first principle is as a a roll-up and an Ethereum layer two, decentralization should not be your first priority.

There's something called escape hatch that your money on Mega will always be safe. There's nothing we can do because you can always bridge it back to layer one. Um I have said this on record before. I'll say it one more time that Mega E is way more secure, decentralized than most layer one. Actually, probably than most layer ones. Because the layer one foundation control the validator, they have a lot of soft power. We have no soft power over Ethereum mainnet, and anyone anyone can bridge their money back to E layer one. That's first principle thinking. I do not have to be decentralized because I'm a freaking decentralized layer one. So that's the first principle. I think that most people who talk about

decentralization was just laughing. As a core team, my ethos has always been how do we grow the industry without losing the cypherpunkness? Yeah. Mega E is is simply the best architecture you can get this done. And it's not Hyperliquid. Yeah. And to to kind of firm up the question, you think that the choice of opting for performance over the whatever other kind of options that you could have was the right option? There's no other option. Yeah. Mega E is the only option. Because, you know, Rob and I are kind of developing this thesis that Okay, Ethereum L1 is really like the home of like high-quality assets, whether they're tokenized assets, large swaths of capital, the home of stablecoins, the home of

longer duration assets as well. Uh we'll see a lot of fixed income stuff come on chain. We'll see a lot of like uh tokenized um any sort of like actual TradFi product on on Ethereum. Solana, maybe more for DEX trading. Mega E, for trading. Hyperliquid obviously perps. But like we're seeing this kind of like split in terms of purpose of chains, like in terms of why they exist. Ethereum is very clearly Like you you could argue that Ethereum doesn't even need to improve to speed up that much because because it's not it's not really for that.

Um I don't know. You're You're a huge Ethereum bull. Like I'm just curious how you're how you're evolving your thesis into L1, Mega E, like how these things come together. Are you thinking about it similarly like high-quality assets, large amounts of capital, stablecoins, layer one, much less, you know, decentralized high-throughput layer two, Mega E, kind of like bringing them together? Like Is that the right way to think about it? Are you still thinking about it that way? I do not think about it anymore. Okay, good. And >> See, this this this is what I mean. We thought about these things for so long.

Yeah, I mean, as a founder, my job is not so much about the semantic layer one, layer two of what others are doing. >> Yeah, yeah. My job is to think about the world I'm seeing, which is you're getting all this, for example, emerging market assets assets, which are very difficult to get on chain, and you can only get it on Mega. Yeah. You can get Sui. For example, today I think I saw that uh Sui spot just launched on transfer to Solana via Sunrise, I think. I'm not interested in it. No. I'm not interested because you can get you can get those assets on centralized exchanges, on many different places.

But the bricks yield, you can only get it on Mega. That's what I'm interested in. >> So uh Serafim from He just recently joined Solana. >> Yeah. >> He He came on and he was like, "We're working on pre-IPO Chinese stocks only on Solana." Is this kind of like how you're thinking? Like what type of more esoteric assets exist out there in the world that you can only get on Mega E? Yep. I think assets are um expressivity instrument. Mm. The world is going to have become more complicated. There are things happening. When things become asset, it gives you an opportunity to express where the world is heading. Mhm.

Um many people know that I spend a lot of time in the Middle East. Mm. And you know, the war happened. >> Right. And you know, there are many different ways you can express the direction of the war other than oil. Right. >> most people do not know, and that's something I'm very interested in seeing playing out. Um one more thing I would add is um you know, people don't believe in globalization anymore. I don't blame them. Mm. But I believe in the globalization of assets. Okay. Okay. Explain what that means?

>> means people who don't live in other countries would still have a view on the asset in that country. Right. So, what you wanted to do is onboard the interest one, allow them to create a story and narrative around it. Right? So, I mean, you can always think about loaning some sort of rock in America and probably hedge it with something else in Asia and things will become so composable uh and the ladder will only deepen. >> Yeah. Um so, yeah, that that's how I think about the I would say the omega assets and again, it goes down to user experience.

Mhm. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think I don't mean to keep trying to put this into mental models, but we're shifting from like a chain-centric view of the world to a very much like an asset-centric view of the world. Like, I am an investor, I'm a speculator, I want to trade, speculate on X asset. Don't really care what chain it's on, I don't really care where it is. I want to get exposure long or short to a certain asset [snorts] and I think that's how like a lot I think that's where the space is progressing towards to much less like, "Oh, like I want to be on this chain because I want to exist on this chain." No, like I want to trade this asset. This asset is here, so I'm going to go here to trade this asset.

Mhm. I disagree. I think I mean, obviously I'm biased. Um I think most people don't think chain matters because chain doesn't know how to market themselves. Okay. Chain market themselves as a boring infrastructure and block producer. That is our mega. Mega has a very interesting innate economic engine via the stable coin. Has a very close ties with the mafia applications and with a lot more interesting things coming up. I almost think I want mega to be a consumer-friendly developer product.

>> Mhm. I want mega to be a you know, a a fashion product. I want to meme mega into existence. I want it to be relevant. I want people to say like, "Hey, I did I loan this asset on mega." Right? And the mega becomes more than a block producer. So, um >> a big bear on like chain abstraction and like this whole like where you operate doesn't matter. If you do a good enough job, they will always come to your chain. Yeah. So, you want you want people to really know and love the mega ETH brand long-term. Yep.

Yeah. And do you feel like you're succeeding in that already? Um I would be lying if I say I succeeded, especially in this market. Right. >> What I think I'm on the right track is both from our creative design and the way we approach our builders, everything is going towards mainstream. Yeah. Um I was sitting with an investor the other day and they asked me the same question. They're like, "Aren't you Don't you want to go approach the Wall Street and wear suits?"

>> Yeah. I was like, "You know, I've I've worn suits in my life. I'm 35. But I think the the game has changed. The Wall Street people don't wear suits anymore. In fact, a lot of the finance bro wear Aloha hat. What I want to be is is a really cool fashion brand that is suits desire to use. I think there there is a It's like the streetwear, the the shoes that the bankers or the hedge fund bros or the AI bros love to they they adore. So, Sure. Okay. Um So, people are going to be curious about what comes next here. People are wondering about this kind of token

dynamic as well as future product launches. I think we're very firmly into an era of like um the the way that tokens are designed and and launched and executed has changed drastically since you guys kind of first started building mega. You know, I'm just curious like how you're thinking about this holistically. People are saying that these things need to look more like equity. They need to have a like there's a equity of mega ETH and a token. They need to be one in the same. People are saying that, you know, they want to see revenues or product or traction. People want to look at the net token value flows in terms of the amount of emissions out, inflation, team unlocks, uh grants, all that type of

stuff and then what's coming into the asset. Like it's just like a more complicated world now. How do you think about this? How are you preparing for this? Yeah, I think yesterday the Optimus guys they >> just That was the bottom of to of of tokens. >> bottom signal. >> That was bad. That was bad. That was so bad. Yeah. Um I was like, I mean, this is my fourth cycle. >> Yeah. At this point, I mean, I'm used to it. I was shocked, but still it was like, "Okay, here we go again." Um If token becomes completely like equity, then there's no fun. Okay. What is the point? Right? Just do equity then.

I think people lack imagination on what they can do with their token. Mhm. >> If you really think about what mega has been doing, we have the KPI for our TGE, but we also have KPI for our long-term token emission. For people who don't remember, majority of mega's token will be allocated to what we call KPI vesting. We're going to hold ourselves accountable to a certain metrics. That could be stablecoin volume, application quality. It can be you know, one of our metric is Ethereum decentralization. Because if Ethereum is not decentralized, then mega becomes centralized and we kind of wanted to be censorship resistant. So, we have all these KPIs and people can, you know, put

their token with different KPI and it allows us to see what community care about. Hold us accountable. The for what's worth, mega's core team only took 9.5% of the total token pie. If you know that, most team takes what? 20, 30%? >> Yeah. Mega team will only earn more token if we fulfill the KPI. That's what I think token should be for. It should be to hold people accountable. It should be able to like listen to community feedback. Obviously, it should generate revenue, right? It It should have some sort of value accrue to users as well.

We have something really beautiful called rotating sequencer. Mhm. >> instead of decentralized sequencer, you can rotate the sequencer based on where the market activity is. So, I'm very bullish on uh token. I'm very bullish on founders being more creative with token. Yeah. >> I'm [snorts] more bullish on being very transparent with token. Um and these are I think how we take over TradFi and don't play the old game. But again, I'm on the more cypherpunk extreme probably than most of your guests.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Um people are going to wonder like, "Have you earned the right to not have to like pay Binance a ton of the supply for for listings?" Like people are tired of Binance. Uh we actually issued a statement last year that we don't pay anyone to list our token. But don't you think things have changed a little bit since then or no? Things have definitely changed. Um But it shouldn't affect that statement. I mean, it does not. I think we're just as usual earlier than everyone.

Uh >> [laughter] >> I see the exchanges are distribution channels. >> Right. A founder should know where their users are. If Binance is a very important area that serves your customers, yeah, do it. Find a fair price and do it. There's no moral judgment. If their users are people who are going to use your chain like ourselves, then yes, do everything to attract people onto your chain. Right. What I found to be very interesting and very much against in crypto is people slap morality onto everything. Right.

>> I found that to be such a just a zero-sum game. People can do whatever they want and the market will tell you what's right. People slam morality onto everything. Yeah. The decay of society, I guess. >> [laughter] >> Uh you know what? There the sentiment gap has never been bigger from what's happening inside of the industry and the natives compared to the suits. And it's appalling and it's it's growing. I I've never seen anything like it in it's my third cycle. It you know, we've never had this much adoption from like large firms and asset managers and allocators, but I've never seen such dismay within the ecosystem.

Mega ETH can be a shining light here. Perhaps. Like what is What do you attribute this to? Why is this so bleak internally, but so sunshine and roses and like we're still early again to some of the largest allocators in the world? What's happening here? Uh the low-hanging fruits are gone. Uh that's what it is. >> Low-hanging fruits like the grifters are gone and I also believe that people who are the loudest on crypto Twitter or among crypto natives, they're they they can be very ignorant and I don't I people notice that I don't spend a lot of time on CT anymore. I also have a company to run. But I think the perception gap is not real and

people who are loud don't understand the truth. What I think the but however, what I think the real gap is, the low-hanging fruits are gone. >> Yeah. What is your cheat code? Mhm. Explain. What is something that you have that no one has? >> Yeah, what's your edge? >> What's your edge? Like the BRICS guys, right? Their edge is they just deeply deeply understand the Turkish market. >> Yeah. And in the meantime, they're deeply, deeply crypto native. >> Yeah. Um you know, the hit one founder, he's been doing crypto his entire life and he did Polymarket growth. Yeah.

>> That is secret code. Uh Dom, the founder of of Dream, was building option protocol Omega. Um you know, dude used to sell sneakers, just like understand consumer really well. Find your secret your cheat code and no one can do and then really double down on it. >> Yeah. Um I think the dismay or the disappointment among crypto native is um how to say? Um it's a it's a symptom that um the days of, you know, putting money in and getting a 10,000 X API is gone. It's probably better for all of us. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Last thing from my side, more about this kind of potential um expansion of assets on Mega. What what's the plans and thoughts towards more enablement of tokenized assets, whether they're T-bills, equities, trading? Is this something that you think your user base cares about or not really? Do you guys have plans to kind of onboard more of these non-speculative or more kind of traditional assets, whether it be tokenized equities, commodities, T-bills, treasuries? Is this part of the strategy?

It depends on our builders. I mean, we also have a team uh called Hello Trade. They're ex-BlackRock. Um exactly. Yeah, so they're looking at all this very mature um I would say tried-and-true assets that people are used to and that's their expertise and you know, we let them do whatever they want. From my own perspective, um the cheat code of the founder matters. So, even if you're able to onboard those assets, how are you going to grow your audience? How do you make sure people buy it? Remains I think every founder's biggest headache. Mhm. So, I always tell people um you know, get the asset onto whatever product you're building, but really think about

who is your initial set of customers. Are we talking about, you know, the I just came from from West Village, which is quite a scene of itself, right? Is it the girl who wears Alo and drinking strawberry matcha in West Village or is it going to be a, you know, Korean going Gangnam or, you know, a degenerative ancient? Really understand who your customers are, yeah. And by the way, it's really it's a very fun process. Yeah. Yeah. Um Wow okay.

Um Do you think Mega ETH can reasonably compete with Hyperliquid on perps? Solana's struggling on perps right now. Obviously, unfortunately, Drift got exploited, but even prior to that, they don't they just don't have the same level of scale that is that Hyperliquid has cracked in terms of trading experience and low latency. You guys claim almost like zero latency and I know Brett is talking a lot about how latency is the new game, not TPS. Do can Mega ETH enable a better trading experience than Hyperliquid?

Yeah, last night Joe and I hang out. There was one team um on Monday. Yeah, they they were like, "Yeah, we tested all the chains and uh yeah, Mega is just technically the best chain and that's why we chose Mega." So, there's technical moat there. Um but I think you would agree that Hyperliquid wins not because of the technical um advantage. Um it's it's that you can just the depths of the liquidity is simply impressive. I, you know, I talked to a lot of whales and they would tell me like, "Yeah, I'd love to trade on another exchange and I can actually farm points." I can't. I can't I there's no depths required over there. So, uh that's Hyperliquid. Uh Mega is a

general purpose blockchain. We don't just compete on perp. Um that has been very clear to me day one. We compete based on novel assets and also novel user experiences. That's it. I don't think about Hyperliquid at all. I also think Jeff is a legendary founder. >> Yeah. Um So, how you guys going to make money? Um I love that question, by the way. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to answer it. No, I love that question. I I have been told that uh because we've been so quiet that most people are not aware of our uh our tokenomics. We uh we have our own native uh stablecoin, which is called USDM. In fact, Mega was the first

protocol, blockchain that actually has its own I would say native uh currency, economic engine, stablecoin. And um the the yield belongs to the protocol, which we're going to use to buy back Mega, the token. So, that's a very, very obvious um revenue-generating model that's going to go back to token holder, right? It's not like the founding team will take any of that. And then, um another one is um when we have enough trading activity, we we have something called proximity market. Mhm. Where you can stake your Mega or buy more Mega and be closer to our sequencer and get, yeah. So, that's

also very interesting. I saw I saw Optimism had an announcement yesterday or the day before doing something similar. You know what's funny is EOS was the first blockchain to kind of do something similar to proximity markets. Oh my god, that's uh brings back so much memory. And so basically, how that works is like as a user, if I stake Mega, I get closer access to the sequencer? Yeah, so yes. >> Directly to my account? So, it depends so whether you're uh retail user or whether you're a market maker, it's actually would make more sense to market makers so you can get much better engine, yeah. Okay, cool.

Nice. So, yeah, thanks for joining. What's on your agenda for the rest of the week in New York? Are you flying out soon? I'm flying out tomorrow. I'm going to uh you know, um there's this ice cream shop that I really like. I used to live uh in Fort Greene. So, I'm dying to go back and uh get a scoop of ice cream. Awesome. Well, thanks for joining. Best of luck and as these KPIs come to a close into into token, into more product launches, into more applications. Ladies and gentlemen, that has been the roll-up this week.