🚨LIVE: CLARITY Officially Delayed To September?! Saylor Almost Back To Par. HL Media, OP & Gate Call

Transcript

[music] [music] Heat. Heat. [music] 17 floor. [music] We'll see you around the timeline.

Feels good to be back. >> [music] >> I think the rollup is one of the most premier media brands in crypto and Andy and Robbie are [music] great experts at everything they talk about and it's my favorite podcast. >> Adding into my library every day >> potentially multi-chain deployments. We are at Dev Connect [music] day one here. I'm guessing from Bat. [music] [music] [music] >> [music]

[music] [music] >> Heat. Heat. [music] >> [music] >> JP Morgan, Black Rockck, DTCC, Fidelity, the entire thing was just institutions.

It's just it's next level. This industry is going to the next level. And guys, I I don't know what else to say. >> I'm bullish. [music] >> HE SAID IT. HE FINALLY said it. >> I'm so bullish. And he's bullish. I'm bullish. We're bullish. [music] [music] >> [music] [music]

>> Heat. Heat. [music] Heat. Heat. [music] >> [music] >> Heat. Heat. N.

[music] [music] >> [music] >> for [music] roll up. It's headed to the top. If we're not already at the top, we're going to the top. We're going >> rollup is my favorite. [music] People >> from all walks of life, all over the world, all over this industry come together for the rollup. Heat. Heat. N.

[music] >> [music] [music] [music] >> Zoom out. The institutions aren't coming. They're simply here. It's the golden age of crypto, guys. Get right.

Let's go. [music] Zoom out. The institutions aren't coming. They're simply here. It's the golden age of crypto, guys. Get right. Let's go. [music] >> Welcome to the nest. See you on the show. The boys in charge of the sound effects today. What is going on, guys? It is August. [laughter] >> All right.

Um, your boy is in charge of the sound effects today. So, we are chopping it up, having some fun. It is Friday, August 7th, and we are here at the rollup, guys. I was just chatting with our friends here behind the scenes. And this is the most apathetic market we've seen in a long, long time. It is so sideways. It is just testing your will and testing your patience. Uh, things do change. Things do happen. And if you just continue to stick around and uh stay diligent, you will reap the rewards of the four-year cycle bare market. Like I said, this is the rollup and uh we're going to be having a great show for you guys again today. What a terrific show yesterday. I mean, yes, clarity got delayed. Uh we do have speaker uh of uh speaker Thun who says that it is going

to be put on the floor to vote in September. So, we know that uh today the Senate is taking a leave of absence. They're going on a recess and uh they're going to come back in September and vote on clarity. So, it's been delayed, but it's not dead. So, we're keeping an eye on that. Uh we had a Clarity Day special yesterday. We chatted with Hib Jesse Pollock of Bass. We had Santiago Santos. We had Olivia and Katherine uh of Avalanche and Chainlink. So, just tremendous lineup as of yesterday. And uh we're going to keep things rolling here today. Um I mean I can just recall a couple, you know, tremendous things.

Had a little switch up there on the overlays. We're having fun here today. It's Friday. We're trying things out. Who knows what's going to happen today. Uh guys, hit us up in the chat. Throw us a little W. You know, subscribe to the channel if you're not already subscribed. Have some fun. We're going to have some fun here today. Um I did remember that yesterday we had uh a few conclusions. one on the clarity side made the point that it's not priced in. There's really nothing to do to price it in. Uh every time that there was some sort of change in the probability that Clarity Act would pass, you know, it had essentially like an 80% chance of getting approved, then it dropped all the way down to 15% and you really couldn't tell in the Bitcoin chart or any other chart for that matter where

there were changes in the probability of clarity passing. that led us to believe that well turns out that whether it passes or it doesn't pass doesn't really matter either way the same things are going to happen doesn't really have an impact on the price so it's really not as big of a deal as everyone was making it out to be uh we heard from pretty much everyone that said institutions are still coming into the space regulators are still going to provide guidance and rules on the industry uh what the Clarity Act does is that it instantiates those rules into law uh But the reality is that, you know, Senate's going to come back from recess and they're going to get back to lawmaking and I do anticipate that we're going to see a vote on this thing in September. So, we

are excited to see that come to fruition. Been a lot of friends in DC that have been working on that and uh we want to see their hard work pay off. Guys, as always, big shout out to our partner in the tokenization tower, Plume. they are uh powering the nest and so we're gonna get back in the nest as of next week. Big shout out to Plume and big shout out to Frack. Uh FRA is our stable coin partner. They are doing incredible things in the genius compatible world of stable coins, open stable and borderless. Uh one of the few stable coins that has been able to associate itself and get into the right places with the right people and associate itself as money. That is what every stable coin is trying to do. A lot

of them are these yieldbearing stable coins that go into these kind of shady unknown, you know, black box of yield sources. It's effectively a hedge fund that passes its uh returns back in the form of a stable coin, interestbearing stable coin. PRA doesn't do that. Uh they're more like cash than a hedge fund. Today's topics, uh, of course, we've got the markets and the weather. We're going to get to that very soon. Uh, HyperMat is going to join us for the grill report out of Hyperlid this week. Uh, I want to talk to him about the Trade XYZ debacle. Uh, it was thought that Trade XYZ might have been raising around.

Turns out they're not raising around. Turns out they're acrewing a ton of value to Hyperlid and specifically Hype the asset. So, we're going to talk to Grill about that. I know he's got some thoughts and opinions there. Um, and then we've got Optimism's co-founder, uh, Carl, uh, and I know, uh, he's a very energetic fella, and so we're going to be chatting with him about the RWA strategy at Optimism. And then we have a recording for you guys. We recorded this interview with the executive director at Gate. They are a centralized exchange, and we're going to run that recording to close up the debt. So, without further ado, let's get right into it. And I'm gonna give you guys a big shout out. Big shout out to Dinari. Uh these guys are

absolutely flooring it on the tokenized equities front and uh I I honestly couldn't ask for a better partner on the tokenized equity side of things because these guys are absolutely crushing it. Tokeniz the entire S&P the widest breadth of assets tokenized equity assets um in the entire space. Uh so you guys I'm sure you've seen you know the likes of several other tokenized equities platforms out there. um the amount of assets, the amount of chains that you can withdraw to and then soon the amount of things that you can do with your tokenized equities. I'd imagine that uh D5 protocols are going to be integrating Dshares far and wide.

Uh the weather is sponsored by Relay. It's hot. What a surprise. Uh don't see hurricane like you saw yesterday. Uh it was pretty pretty intense storm yesterday. We know uh it's snowing where my uh my lovely co-host is and so uh it's hot, it's warm, and uh we are set up for a fantastic weekend. Uh hopefully we stay away a little bit more from the rain. Big shout out to Relay as always. These guys will take you anywhere you need to go with their uh crosschain product uh built for payments and uh incur really uh I mean helping several institutions and neo banks uh embrace the onchain world. So, a lot more from their team very soon.

It's Friday and uh we want to tell you guys about everything in the market. So, let's go ahead give a shout out to our friends at Zama. Zama is the privacy partner for the show. Uh they're doing incredibly well in the privacy world and uh we are happy to have them as partners as well because privacy tech is important. It's in it's significant and uh it's incredibly impactful in today's world. That's why we see the likes of Zama and Zcash uh doing incredibly well. Uh and so we are very very excited to have uh Zama on as partners and they're doing fantastic work. You can shield all your assets with the Zama protocol.

Everything's flat. Near's down a little bit under that 160 mark. Not sure why that's happening. Bitcoin looks like it's headed higher for I mean it's been this way for quite a long time. We don't know how uh you know likely it is that this is sustainable but we've continuously seen a bottom forming bottom forming on Bitcoin as well as some of the other digital assets on this chart here. Everything pretty much flat but just continuously just charges higher and higher. Feels like we've been pushing you know 64 65 uh but ultimately we're we're in apathy. I mean it's just sideways. And so uh what do you do to pass the time? uh out we've had friends of the show come on and say

look now's the time to play squash you know just pretty much zoom out touch some grass build your positions day in and day out you know continue to acrue acrew acrew think in terms of units of these coins that you want to own for the long haul uh Bitcoin is a great example of this ETH good example of this Zcash another great example of this for instance we want to get to a certain number of Bitcoin and Zcash cash so that when we stick it in the vault and we don't touch it, we come back 10 years from now, we can keep in our mind, oh, I own this many units of that irregardless of the price. And I imagine that we're seeing those sorts of buyers on Bitcoin and Zcash. Um, the fact that we're going

into the into the weekend, uh, I, you know, we know that it's been volatile over the weekends in the equities markets. Uh we've also been talking about how al the altcoin complex seems to be rather correlated with the equities markets whereas Bitcoin is starting to kind of decorrelate decouple from the equities markets a little bit more tied to macro. Uh and then gold had a big bounce up as well and I think that is something we're watching and uh we're starting to see some similarities between gold and bitcoin. Uh we've got Edward in the chat talking about clarity. Dems want to delay the clarity vote so that they can milk fair shake for midterm donations before voting no in September. Yeah, that would be pretty

insane, right? If they just say no, they they stall this thing out, they milk our industry for more donations, and then uh they end up putting the mix on this thing. Anyway, I saw a similar tweet from our guy at uh Plume Salman uh the chief of legal there who said um the Dems, you know, they uh they got spooked at the final hour uh and they do want to get this thing through. However, uh there was some complications that said, look, you know, even though we want to, you know, regulate this industry, and it feels like a win for the Democrats. I mean, you're looking at this. Democrats have been wanting to regulate this industry for so long and so finally we get some legislation on the table and

they're just choosing no, it's not good enough. Guys, something is better than nothing as it pertains to the Clarity Act. Um, regardless, it's sideways and so now is a great time to sort of uh just kind of focus on something, you know, aside from the markets and just continue to build those positions. That's ultimately what I'm watching. I'm building these positions, but I'm also starting to work on things. I'm vibe coding. I'm building mechanisms and workflows for our business here at the rollup so we can provide every one of you with more good content exactly what you guys want to see and know. Uh and we've got some tremendous guests as we get ready for the conference circuit in the fall. Uh so I'm extremely excited about where we're headed. But that those

are the markets. I mean you guys have seen how things have gotten shooken up on the macro side. uh and uh we know that this is uh this is something that we're watching both you know the commodities market oil gold as well as the bond market rates on the long end are headed higher and then of course uh you know equities and crypto we watch uh very closely uh as always big shout out to Zama but also big shout out to near you see them on this chart there uh we believe there's some very exciting things headed uh headed forward for near uh they've got their intense product they've got their per product. They've got AI. I mean, this is becoming a full suite, one account, no borders, your entire financial life onchain at

near.com. Uh they've got some very cool things that are going to be rolling out very soon. And I mean, there's really no better place to get exposure to privacy, exposure to AI, and exposure to digital assets all in one place. Uh and so that is why we are extremely excited about partnering with Near. Without further ado, we are going to show you one of the most cringe videos that I have seen in an long time. Uh, I didn't watch this entire thing. Sometimes I review what goes on to the run of show, but I didn't watch this whole thing. It was literally so painful to watch that I had to turn it off within about 10 seconds. So, we're going to play the entire two-minute clip. And, uh, if this loses

us viewers, uh, I'm sorry. just join back after two minutes or put it on mute or something because uh this is truly one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen. Let's go ahead and play the clip. Good evening, shareholders. The market is pricing fear. I'm pricing Bitcoin. [music] The quarter was rough, but the SAS per share rose. They saw a selling. Everybody froze. 32 [music] coins just to test the machine. 0.004% barely seen. Then we bought 48 times more than we sold. But bears read one headline and hit caps lock bold. Own the

most capital. Issue the strongest credit. Create the best equity. Rinse and repeat it. Bitcoin [music] is the winner. The credit turbine spins. They say the quarter's over. I say the century begins. Own [music] the most capital. Increase the sats per share. You saw us sell some Bitcoin. We bought 48 times more this year. SRC at 8950. Everybody asks, "Michael, can you bring this thing to par fast? We've got the cash. We've got the Bitcoin stack and nearly 1 billion left in the buyback. Not too slowly, not too quick. Calibrate the market. Make the credit [music] stick. Sure, a billion dollars. Go ahead, be my guest. to pay

12% a year to help us build [music] the best. Maybe the best way to buy the most Bitcoin is not to buy the most Bitcoin. I'm going to sell one and then I'm going to buy 10. You want us to sell none and somehow buy 11 with money conjured by a genie underneath the desk. We don't quite have that. We have digital credit instead. Own the most capital. [music] Issue the strongest credit. Create the best equity. Rinse and repeat it. We want the world's largest company. That's the company ambition. Not the most employees, not the most products, the highest valuation. Own the most capital.

Let the credit turbine spin. 600 million became [music] 60 billion. And we're only just beginning. Bitcoin is money. Everything else is credit. Gosh. Thank you for joining the earnings call. We bought 48 [music] times more Bitcoin than we sold. [laughter] >> [music] >> Yeah. And you bought it higher than you sold. You're supposed to buy low, sell high. Oh my god. Sailor, who what what PR person said that was a good idea? That was literally painful to watch. Um, I mean, look, maybe they're just going for the absolute cringe mode and, you know, they're looking to get more viewers of

their earnings call and then they know that what they're going to put it on they're going to clip it, put it on Twitter and then we're going to be talking about it. Like, but what kind of press is that? What? This is a public company. I saw the the uh capital holdings of Bitcoin treasury companies. Strategy owns like 838,000 Bitcoin. The next closest owns like 42,000. That means Michael Sailor, the guy who you just saw rapping on a remixed earnings call, his company owns 800,000 more Bitcoin than any other company on planet Earth.

And he's on here rapping his earnings call. Couple of those beats were kind of fire, not going to lie. But the lyrics, oh my god, the songwriting was that was just horrid. But uh big big shout out to whoever made that beat. Let's keep moving along. This is a serious show. We've got institutional viewers. They're uh they uh they come they watch us for uh more of this cryptoclarity act vote until after summer recess. Yeah. I mean, you guys heard all about it yesterday. You heard all about it this morning. uh uh leader Thun is uh delaying this thing until uh until the September uh the September return of the Senate. So, we aren't going to see

much on the Cryptoclarity Act until that happens. Uh but we shall see. Um and uh look, there's a recess. We're going to start to kind of zoom out. I'd imagine that we're actually going to see like a new narrative be born in this period between now and September. Uh but that's effectively what we're seeing on the cryptoclarity act. Uh Senate Majority Leader John Thun. So the bill will be cued first when lawmakers return in September. I mean that's who you want in your corner uh for the entire industry is the Senate Majority Leader. He is the one that is able to put bills on the floor for the closure vote. And he says that it's going to be one of the first ones queued up for when lawmakers return in September. I tend to take his word

for it, but I think we're going to just kind of cool down all of the clarity conversation here for about a month and then we're going to pick it right back up in a month when Senate returns from their recess. Uh, and so that means that we've got a lot to talk about because we've already got uh tokenized equities and we've got shared liquidity protocols. Uh, and this is what we're seeing play out. And so we want to give a shout out to 1 in. These guys have been a terrific partner uh on the show and they've pioneered uh their Aqua product which is the shared liquidity protocol but the innovation is that the money stays in your wallet. Uh this is in particular uh it's unique, it's new and it allows you to contribute your liquidity to multiple liquidity

pools at the same time because it's just an allowance uh and those pools can pull your liquidity out on your behalf whenever it makes sense. uh given the protocols uh and the liquidity conditions and so that is uh in particular that is what uh we're watching on the 1 in side again fantastic partner we're happy to have them on let's keep moving along here uh Chia Wang front of the show been on a few times uh I will always fund a smart 20-year-old to build a startup no baggage insane risk appetite ruthless speed massive ego but I will never let a 20-year-old manage my money for the exact same reasons perhaps a defining mindset difference between the East Coast and the West Coast. This is obviously shot at Leopold

who got liquidated by Kenny G, Mr. Citadel, the big Griffin. Uh, and you know what? He's probably right. The fact is, uh, the massive risk appetite is great if you're going for a venture bet, in which case you're going for a zero or a grand slam. Uh, that is what you're looking for. You're looking for the grand slam. It takes a certain founder certain kind of mindset, mentality, psychology in order for you to ultimately hit that grand slam. Uh not everyone can do it and so you want to take bets on the people that even have a chance to do it. Uh and so um that is a very fundamentally different mentality that is proven to be successful in making and managing money. Uh managing

money requires prudence. Uh it requires patience. Uh it's not go go go, always innovate, always push the push the needle forward and try to move fast and break things, try to figure things out, fail fast. You don't want to fail fast if you're managing money. Uh I've seen some of the most successful people uh that are money managers, they take like four trades a year. They sit back, they wait extremely patiently for the opportunity to emerge. And when it does, they hit it hard. But they are not failing fast. They are not trying to slam into a brick wall. uh they are simply letting the market come to them uh and they're listening very intently to what the market is telling them. So I think Chia Wang is extremely correct uh with this take uh as it pertains to east

coast west coast um yes uh would be curious to hear a little bit more about the way in which east coast and west coast founders and money managers are thinking differently. I think that's probably another conversation, but what he talks about 20-year-olds, you know, managing money versus founding companies, I think is extremely true and I agree. Let's keep moving along. Uh, we've got a Bitcoin rotation. Uh, main focus here from Will Clementes that personally the end of year is getting allocitated to Bitcoin again in a many very meaningful way from here to the end of the year getting allocated to Bitcoin in a very meaningful way. had fun with gold and silver breakouts last year, did pretty well with equities this

year, but mostly from momentum and think less easy from here, especially with all of CT trading there now. It does feel like all of the attention is on equities. Uh we saw Micron, you know, semis, DRRAM, all these things, the AI bottleneck trade move down the risk curve, move down the supply chain. Uh that's where all the attention is and it feels like now we've just established this really wide range on equities. we hit massive highs uh had big big corrections in the equities markets across the entire uh sector and spectrum of the AI trade and so now we're seeing some of those sectors recover hyperscalers are doing better semis are doing a little bit better as of recently but it just doesn't really feel like

we're going to move forward with the type of vigor and acceleration that we previously move forward with and so I tend to agree here as well I think Bitcoin is just holding the line it's pretty incredible with all of the negativity that's been surrounding Bitcoin. Uh the Clarity Act not passing. Uh this has all been somewhat bearish for crypto, but we haven't seen that reflected in prices. So, I think that is extremely positive. Uh remember, before you go up, you have to not go down, and that's what's happening now. We've just been holding the line, not going down. So, if we can continue to do this, I think we're going to be in a really great spot uh when the volatility returns. Um we got some comments in the chat. Uh, Edward, huge ETH ICO OG is buying lit.

Is this one of you guys? Uh, not going to confirm or deny. CF CFTC approval for PERBs is all we need. Yeah, I do think, you know, I think uh, Lighter and Vlad have been doing some things in DC uh, with the CFTC innovation committee and then I saw that there was something from the agricultural committee which obviously is a big player in the CFTC and commodities world. uh I think they came out with something as well. Uh so that is what we're seeing here today. So let's continue. Uh we are going to talk a little bit more about the ARC mainet which is coming in September

16th. Uh we are discussing about uh potentially collaborating with the ARC team and bringing you guys some fantastic content from the launch of the ARC mainet. Uh they partner with some big big heavy hitters. Black Rockck, DTCC, Galaxy, Global Pay, Mastercard, Moneygram, ICE, SBI, Stand Chart, uh and Visa, and more. Uh so they've got quite a few more uh tricks up their sleeve as it pertains to uh ARC, the mainet, the way in which they are going to roll out this blockchain. Look, I remember talking about ARC uh back a little bit earlier in the summer and the idea was that this is going to be a powerhouse for Forex. That is really where I think

there's a lot of opportunity for a new market to emerge on chain. I think ARC is the place to do that because they've got such a stronghold in the stable coin market. uh USDC of course and circle are primarily focused on US dollar denominated stable coins but there is a market that we're going to see some greater regional stable coins and I think where else are you going to build the liquidity for foreign exchange if it's not very close in proximity to one of the leading stable coins in the market today so I think there's a big strong position and opening for uh foreign exchange to be done on chain on arc So I'm watching that intently and I I would imagine look uh you know we know

USDC is very tightly integrated into some of these per platforms uh into DeFi as a whole and so I' I'd imagine that we are going to see more DeFi deployed more perpetuals uh volume open interest move over to ARC uh it's just a matter of time tokenized equities I'd imagine as well are going to emerge on ARC and I bet they have some tricks up their sleeve with this as well. So, several asset classes and it feels like look, Circle's got, you know, they're one half of the duopoly in the stable coin space. Uh, everywhere else is fair game.

Tokenized equities, tokenized deposits, uh uh payments forex per prediction markets, prediction markets, you know, might be getting monopolized or dopized as well. But every other asset class, it feels like it's just a wide open door uh, for the taking. And I'd imagine that we're going to see some market share from the applications that choose to deploy on the ARC blockchain. Let's keep things moving here. Uh we've got quite a few things that we want to bring forward for you guys today. We just had Edward chatting about this in the chat. Uh so whale accumulation on lighter. He's back. Mega OG ETH whale. We know it's an ETH whale because he was in the ETH ICO.

Edward uh what are you thinking here? What are you thinking here, Edward? Because he, this guy, this mega OG ETH, they are buying your bags. They're firing non-stop clips into Lighter at a rapid pace. Another one 1 million bought in the past hour. This was as of yesterday. 9 million Lighter acquired. 53 million in stables remaining. That's just in that wallet. Uh, and then we did see Lighter break out over uh the last couple of days and it's charging towards that $2.50 mark. Uh, you guys probably see it on the scroller at the bottom. Uh, and we're going to work on getting our markets widget updated as well. Uh, so we are big fans of lighter. I'm actually going

to pull up uh what we're seeing on the lighter chart now. Uh, Bitcoin holding steadily on that 64 mark. Uh, Zcash, Zcash is green on all time frames, looking fantastic. Um, Aerodrome looking good as well. Lighter down a little bit down at that 233 mark, but overall up 12% this week. So, it is uh very very cool to see them winning and I anticipate that they will continue to win as well. Uh we've got our daily equity segment coming up and so we're going to get over to our friends at the Kobe SC letter because there is uh plenty happening in the equities world as you guys know. Let's go ahead and run daily equity.

>> [music] >> All right, Americans who own assets are winning. What a surprise. Uh Americans are benefiting from inflation and the debasement trade. The denominator uh just continues to inflate, inflate, inflate. And so we've got record equity wealth. We've seen US household equity holdings have reached a record $74 trillion. Uh pretty insane. 74 trillion is a massive asset class. All of this is getting tokenized, by the way. Uh and we've seen how AI has benefited and grown as a result. And then all of this has moved uh steadily down the supply chain. All of the capex buildout, all of this is getting deployed into the AI

market. Was also watching a clip earlier that said uh Bitcoin has closely followed M2 for a while. Typically, it does about 83% of the time Bitcoin follows M2. uh right now is the 17% of the time that it is not. So uh what we're seeing is that M2 is rising, equities are keeping pace. I'd imagine there's going to be a catch-up trade in digital assets that is going to catch up uh to the debasement trade and what we're seeing in equities. But you know, I think what this shows, guys, and look, we're a show that is telling you everything you need to know about digital assets. We're going to continue to do that. We're going to bring you guys education, alpha information from deep within some of these companies and the trenches, everything that's

happening in new innovative blockchainbased finance, open finance, internet capital markets. The reality is that this is just becoming fintech. I hesitate to call the rollup a fintech show, but that is what it's evolving into. And so many of you listening are probably thinking, hey, should I have migrated over to the equities world or should I have traded gold and silver when it was rallying? And I'd imagine that now everything is becoming integrated. You know, we're getting proximity amongst all of these asset classes. And so someone who trades Bitcoin is probably also going to trade gold and stocks as well. And this is what we're seeing everything become more integrated. Uh, and I think we're going to start to, you know, embrace this

trend as well because look, the reality is if if you wanted to outperform everyone over the last cycle, you would have migrated away from Bitcoin, away from crypto unless you turned short, you would have held some of these AI equities, you would have bought into DRRAM and bought into memory and bought into semis, and you would have done incredibly well if you can time the rotations. And so obviously now if you guys have been watching the show day in and day out like we've been on the show hosting it, you know that Bitcoin is the most apathetic that it's ever been. You know that we're in a pre-bull cycle and we're in this transitory phase between bare and bull. And so you know that it's just a matter of time before the capital rotates back into this industry. But if you were outside of this industry paying

more attention to AI, equities, semis, drram, the reality is that you wouldn't really know what is happening inside. And so you wouldn't realize how apathetic the market really is and you would be a little bit less knowledgeable or a little bit more out of the loop as far as when this rotation might take place. So there's benefits about staying narrow, staying in your lane. That's what we're doing here. And then obviously if you can time those rotations nice and timely, then there's going to be big big wins as well. But we're going to continue just providing everything that we think you guys need to know because this is where we focus.

We spend our time and this is where we can really help you guys out uh for all of you watching here. So let's go ahead and continue moving along. That's been today's daily equity. That is how uh the equity trade is playing out and how we think the rotation is going to play out from equities into digital assets. Couple more for you guys before we get into our Hyperlquid Beef.HL grill report here for today. Uh Hyperlquid and Letter are the two winning Clobs. Obviously, Clob stands for centralized limit order book.

uh and goes on to say that Hyperlid is uh ultra efficient per in for platform thinks reaching uh the strategy's platform piece is the best way to understand the strategy. Uh at many points, Hip 3 mobile lending spot hyperlquid has chosen to be somewhat credibly neutral. A lot of teams do this but become too general and they allow others to build on top of their platform. Trade XYZ being the best example of this. Let's go ahead scroll down a little bit and see how lighter is approaching a similar but different uh strategy to scale. Lighter is playing more like Robin Hood retail growth verticalize and build many of the components like spot trading which is

notoriously one piece of infrastructure that Hyperlid has been lacking on. Uh lighter also has a two-tier fee system attracts real real retail users uh who then attract real organic market makers. Uh, real ZK allows for more composability and future upgrades. I think the point of this is that both of these protocols can win. Uh, when we're thinking about a powerhouse of per, we're probably thinking about lighter. That might sound surprising, but when you're looking at Hyperlid, you're thinking more about, you know, this more generalized variety, more variable uh, platform that has several applications.

But the reality is that we haven't seen a lot of the ecosystem projects on Hyperlquid do extremely well with the exception of Trade XYZ. They have been the one that shows look they are able to um they are able to sustain a ton of activity, get a ton of revenue uh as a result of building on Hyperlid. Um New Type says he wants Fogo on the show. We can work on it. We can work on it. Don John people just farming lighter hyperlid real users. I mean I can tell from firsthand experience there are real users on both lighter and hyperlquid. Um look people might be farming both for some future airdrop. Uh but there are

real users as well on both. Uh new type you like super liinal per platform built on Fogo. Uh they're coming after lighter and hyperlquid. Coming after lighter and hyperlquid. I mean they've got a long way to go but I'll believe it when I see it. I want to see competition here. And uh more players in this space is better for the end user. Uh let's go ahead keep moving along. Nice little diagram here that shows you what we're talking about. Hyperlid a little bit more horizontally integrated with several teams. A little bit more generalized, lighter, vertically integrating several products into their own stack. Not as many others building on their own stack. Uh a couple more here before we get into the grill report from Beef

Punch Bowl news. Uh we had our friend of the show Salman uh who's very plugged into the Clarity Act and DC crypto scene uh says that uh Democratic leadership warned their GOP counterparts that a failed closure bill might kill the whole endeavor forcing the majority to blink. So pretty interesting development here because obviously Republicans have been leading but Democratic leadership warning their GOP counterparts that a fail closure bill means that Republicans ultimately shut this down because the Democrats were like, "Hey, you don't want this to go to the floor and vote and then the vote fail." I would agree with that, but the sake of, you know,

this being now pinned on the Republicans doesn't make a ton of sense. Uh let's scroll down a little bit. The news here is that obviously the Clarity Act was not on the agenda. Uh Senate Majority Leader Thun announced that it would not see a vote until September. Uh Punch Bowl News reported earlier Thursday evening that the fate of the Clarity Act had emerged um as a serious um uh sticking point in negotiations to close out the work period. Uh we told you Tuesday morning Democrats didn't want to vote on the Clarity Act without more time to negotiate which now means until midepptember.

So we know this is going to get paused until September. Uh this is effectively what uh what this means. And uh man I mean after so much work in DC trying to get this thing through this is uh this is an unfortunate reality but it's the one that we are faced with. So let's keep moving along. We've got Vlad here, uh, who's announcing a challenge, uh, prove your challenge with IEN Labs. Let's go ahead and play the clip. Hey guys, I'm Vlad, founder and CEO of Lighter. Uh, we're doing something really special with our friends at Labs.

So, we're opening up our production ZK prover, you know, the one that runs on 30,000 Mac minis in the background for anybody to be able to submit improvements to make it faster and more efficient. and we're going to benchmark those against uh a bunch of tests we're running with IGEN Labs. The winners are eligible for prize pool of 15,000 lip. So, we hope to see builders try this out and uh we're excited to see what happens. >> Hey guys, I'm Vlad, founder and CEO. >> I like this. Um I'm not super technical here. I would have to do some pretty deep research, technical research. But what he's saying here is that there is a large large rewards pool for people that are helping to prove ZK proofs on

lighter. And they're doing this in collaboration with iigen labs uh which is obviously another very technical team uh experience with ZK and AI. Uh and so uh if you have some you know compute GPUs uh CPUs even you can prove ZK proofs. Uh, and this is going to enter you into this pool for some extra rewards. Uh, which is very, very cool. Uh, it's almost like, hey, if you missed out on mining Bitcoin way back in the day, uh, now you can actually contribute your um, compute into mining ZK. And, uh, I think a lot of people um are going to want to do this if they have the technical expertise and the knowhow and the hardware in order to uh, achieve

such a thing. And so that is uh that is something very cool um what uh what we're seeing here out of lighter and I anticipate and I'll just give you guys some stats here on what we're already seeing on the lighter side uh which is that this challenge invites agents and humans uh to to uh optimize lighter zk prover for its Ethereum L2 exchange. Uh the competition offers 15,000 lighter in prizes worth roughly 30K uh with submissions tracked on the lighter.fast leaderboard. All right guys, we got one more tweet before we bring up our friend of the show. Uh let's go ahead and run it.

Okay, flood here has sort of a random portfolio construction, but think this is decent. Will be interesting to see how this performs in coming months. I think this is exactly what we needed to frame the integration between equities, commodities, digital assets. This is what we want. And so what he's got here is uh Bitcoin first and foremost. Uh he's got a handful of equity names as well as the S&P uh as as an indicy. Uh and then he's got a couple other altcoins on here. He's got Hype and Pump. Uh both of those doing incredibly well in terms of revenue. And then you've got uh Lily, Google, Amazon, S&P 500, and Robin Hood rounding out the equities pile. Pretty big names there.

Not a ton of surprise. I mean, Google and Amazon uh are the hyperscalers that bounced the hardest off the lows. S&Ps, the indices, you know, just continuing uh to climb. I I don't think Worch or Bessant are going to really let that thing slow down. And then Robin Hood uh is an interesting one because it ties into the thesis that we heard from Santiago yesterday. They've got such a diverse set of business lines. Uh all of them generating millions of dollars in revenue. Uh and we anticipate they do quite well especially as they build out more of this tokenized equities offering. So that is going to, you know, allow them to uh create more efficient settlement, reduce expenses to their bottom line, and I'd imagine they're

going to start to generate a lot more revenue if the market returns and Robin Hood chain uh picks up a a good bit of activity from that. Uh and then he says what he's short, um which is BNB. Some fun names here. ETH when it's above 3K. We know Flood has been notoriously bearish on ETH. I tend to think that Bitcoin or excuse me that ETH can do pretty well in the near term. Uh obviously it has to overcome this revenue debacle and so we don't know exactly how it's going to do that. And then he's uh he's shorting the bounce on a lot of memory SanDisk uh Micron SK Highix Oracle AMD uh and then DRRAM as well. So uh he's shorting this memory bounce uh more volume and revenue

and uh power into these hyperscalers uh and so we are seeing uh flood with uh quite a unique portfolio construction but I think this is something to pay attention to. I actually think the flood portfolio uh is going to perform quite well um depending on how those equities performs. I think I wouldn't really get too too big into those shorts because I do think that Bessin de Warsh can keep this thing going for quite a while. But everything that he has in the long category I think uh is uh is is really in a good spot. I would just add a couple to Hype Pump Fund and Bitcoin as well as the equity names I would add Zcash lighter and probably aerodrome as well into that bucket. As we get a

little later into the year some other names that I would uh consider but that's it. That is uh how I would be thinking about the portfolio construction. I think uh Flood does a great job kind of setting the scene there and uh hopefully you guys pick up a thing or two from the show today. We are going to get into our first guest. Uh Beef is going to join us. There he is. We are going to bring him up on the show. I see he's ready in the back. Let's go ahead and bring him up. Uh he is going to share the grill report uh per usual with us every Friday. We've got Beef joining us. And so there he is. He's up on the show now. Beef, it's a pleasure to have you back.

>> Man, I love how you guys are keeping it going, dude. Good show so far. >> Absolutely. Thank you. Appreciate it. You're uh keeping it going as well. I think this is going to be our third grill report, right? >> Hell yeah, man. You hear it sizzling. [laughter] >> Oh, man. I'm ready. I'm ready. Let's Let's get into it. Tell us uh what we missed on the Hyperlid ecosystem this week. >> Love it. All right, so price check. Everybody knows, right? Uh big things for this week, you know, the clarity obviously you covered it. And then there was a unlock from the team this week. So we dipped a little bit on that coupled with some FUD regarding one of the OG airdrop recipients, uh Laurel, you know, I'm going to name him. He's kind of uh turned bearish on the timeline and

recently did some unstaking as well. So you see a little bit of the market jittering um probably with the combination of all that, but short-term is just noise in my opinion and not financial advice. Well, beef, let me let me also just call out before we move off this, I think another thing that our community wants to hear about and and uh talk about is this trade XYZ. Like they said there was speculation that they were raising capital. Uh people thought that they might do things so drastic to which they would leave the Hyperlid platform, start building out their own Pers exchange. Turns out they didn't do that. Uh they're actually acrewing value to Hyperlid and specifically, you know, using the value that they acrewed to buy Hype. So maybe you have more on that in

the grower report a little bit later. I don't want to frontr run you, but I I think that is certainly something that we uh we want to chat about today. >> Yeah, for sure. I do have a slide in a little bit. Uh so it's up to you. I could talk about it now or we could talk about it in a couple minutes. >> Let's uh let's do it in a couple minutes. Let's uh let's see what else you got here. >> Let's keep it cooking. All right. So HIPP 3 uh we're obviously pushing big numbers now for the RWA scene on Hyperlid. Um it's fantastic to see. I've got some other slides too that are going to touch on some cool stuff just further validating.

Uh Beef, I think we might have we might have lost your audio there for a second. Um didn't catch it. Oh, you might be back. We're going to pull you back to the green room just to make sure that we got a good connection for you. Uh, and then we'll we'll see you back in a little bit. Let's just make sure that we got beef locked and loaded here. Um, but look, in the meantime, I mean, I'll just tell you guys what I have here on my notes, which is that uh, look, the the Q2 report uh, is telling us a lot in the grill report here for Hyperlid. Um, I also see that they flipped Bybit. And so um let's go ahead and, uh, let's go ahead and bring Beef back up. I think he's got plenty more to share with us. And so,

let's go ahead pull him back up and, uh, make sure that we got we got Beef locked and loaded here. >> Hello. Hello. >> There he is. >> All right. Don't know what happened there, but we're going to keep pushing here. So, uh, yeah, HIPP 4, we're seeing some some good volume pickup, too. I think the past like, uh, six, seven days, we're starting to see a nice floor being set as far as volume. So, that's good to see, you know, with everything happening on testn net. Um, to see that kind of liquidity starting to trickle in more consistently is a good thing.

>> And beef, what are the primary prediction markets that are generating a lot of this volume? Is it mostly cryptonative stuff? Is it political stuff? Is it, you know, what what what is garnering $400 million in volume on the prediction market side for HIP 4? >> Yeah. So, currently right now it's just um crypto like different crypto markets like Bitcoin, ETH, Hype, and I think Solana too. And it's pretty much will it be above or below like a particular set price. Uh but we did have major volumes coming through when we had um the World Cup. So, that was pretty exciting. And then on testn net, we could see that they're starting to do templates for like NFL games. Um, you know, different different things are coming. This unlock

when we go to permissionless is really going to open up the floodgates as far as the different kinds of markets you could do with HIP 4. So, right now, >> there's going to be permissionless prediction markets on HIP for Hyperlid. How does that how does that work? How are they able to because t typically like we've tracked prediction markets for a long long time. Um, traditionally like it was almost impossible to do permissionless market listings because of two reasons. Primarily one, you would get duplicate listings in which liquidity and volume would be fragmented. You know, you would have, you know, the same listing multiple times. You know, is there, you know, who's going to be the next president? Everyone wants, you know, a portion of those fees. And so, you're going to get like seven different

markets unless there's some sort of, you know, segmentation on those. The second one was a regulatory concern where people would list like assassination markets. This is what shut down Augur. Like one of the first applications on Ethereum was Augur. It was going to be a prediction market. Uh and it got shut down for someone listing an assassination market. How is Hyperlid dealing with some of these considerations as they they look for permissionless market listings? >> Yeah, so you know that's kind of a tricky thing to navigate. Um, I believe what they're going to do, this is my opinion, is uh different frontends will show different markets. Uh, plus to be able to deploy these permissionless

markets, you have to be staking 500,000 hype. I don't know if there's some validator like voted on penalty if you start doing things that are like, you know, like you said, like assassination markets or something like that, you know, but if you have that much skin in the game, I don't know that you want to risk it by posting something like that, then I'm sure like the market on wouldn't even be that great anyway. Um, that's more for like a meme, you know, shock value in my opinion. Um, so hopefully we stay clear of that, but I think that different frontends are going to show or not show different markets.

Um, that's how I think they would handle that. >> Got it. Got it. Okay, that makes that makes sense. I think you're right. With that much skin in the game, that's uh quite a bit to lose if uh, you know, they do something like that. I imagine there's maybe some, you know, maybe call it terms of service or at least just something in the docs that explains what staking entails and they can avoid that so they don't get some of their stake burned. >> Yeah. And and like I touched on too, I don't know if this is how it works exactly, but they are developing templates on testn net. So that might also kind of um you know help categorize the different things. It's not like completely loose. So maybe we won't get those weird custom niche markets, but

then also the more people who want to deploy the better because again you're you're locking up 500,000 hype. So if somebody really wants to launch those niche markets where you might not get much volume, go ahead. you got my permission and and like I said, maybe front ends just won't show them. >> Yeah, makes sense. >> Cool. >> Yeah. >> Um, okay. The hype ETF. And actually be before we continue here on on this, uh, we've got a comment in the chat from Don John. Uh, maybe you have this later in the slide as well, but, uh, he's asking about the hype test net expansion of collateral rate. Not even sure what that is, but he heard it's going from 50 to 75%. Maybe you can just tell us if this is uh true or fake news and uh explain a

little bit what is the hype test net expansion of the collateral rate. Oh yeah. Now this is bullish news in my opinion. So what he's referring to is uh recently it's on test net now you can only unlock 50% of your hype collateral um on hyper core with portfolio margin and now they're going to bump it to 65%. So, you'll be able to borrow more. So, that'll help people. I mean, you know, they're probably not doing this for this reason, but it'll help people on this draw down. And, uh, bullishwise, I think it's extra bullish, you know, speculation. If they were to do like an S3 airdrop, you're you're giving people uh a venue to instantly deploy whatever

they were airdropped into portfolio margin. They could borrow against it. That's tax advantageous. you know, you don't have to pay capital gains there uh for what you borrow. So, that's kind of cool. Um, yeah, there's lots of reasons why it's a good thing, but I think this is an awesome unlock just getting people access to more funds. So, yeah, super bullish and I didn't cover that in the slide, so thanks for bringing that up. >> Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. >> So, uh yeah, please. >> Yeah. So, moving into this uh next section here, we're seeing some good inflows uh with the hype ETF. some of these rough days. Yeah, we see some outflows, but the inflows are much higher. Um, [snorts] yeah, and we're just crossing 250,000 holders on Hyper

Core for Hype. So, that that tells you how early we are uh in regards to like Solana. We're not really including like sex numbers here. It's just on Hyper Core, but still, I think it shows like very early trajectory for growth. Um, which is a great thing if you're already here. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. >> And then 7-day fees, you know, we're burning 178,000 hype this week. So, that's fantastic. Continuing to reduce that supply. We've touched on it before. Be on the lookout for when that uh USDC yield comes through and starts buying back even more. Uh that'll be very interesting to see. And I'm excited for when, you know, people are like, "All

right, that's enough." and then they start preparing for that next unlock and and buying again pretty pretty heavily. Not financial advice. >> And so yeah, I mean tell us just a little bit more about that. When do you think we can expect some of that USDC revenue sharing to start coming through? Yeah. So, I don't have the numbers or the dates in front of me uh right now, but I believe that the the yield starts generating soon and then the first like buybacks and burns are going to start happening in early October. So, I think you're going to get um some of that that yield kind of churning, growing now, and then they're going to flick that switch and then start the buybacks. I could be

wrong about that, but that's what I think I remember. >> Got it. Okay. Uh beef, we got a couple more questions here in the chat for you. if you're up for it. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Um, so another question from our same guy, Don John heard that the state of Wyoming bought per hyperlquid strategies. Can you uh confirm or deny this rumor? >> Sure. Here, let me uh I got some other stuff I'm going to talk about too, but here I can I can pivot to it. >> Skip ahead a little bit. There we go. >> Yeah. Yeah. So Shondaanda Deans uh definitely worth a follow if you're not, but he showed this uh post and then with some followed it up with the evidence too. But yes, it's true. The state of Wyoming is has bought per the the DAT uh

Hyperlquid Strategies with David Sheamus CEO. >> Super exciting stuff. I know you guys are a big fan. You've had him on a few times. I'm a huge fan, too. This is signaling in my mind like just the legitimacy that's growing. you now have states doing it. Um, Wyoming is kind of a unique state because I think that Cynthia Lumis is from Wyoming if I'm not correct. So, yes. So, that's interesting as well, you know, like that they're very open to crypto there. Uh, this is a good thing to see. So, yes, true >> factual news. [laughter] Okay. Very cool that we have uh literally states uh going in here. Uh, one from our friend Edward. Now, I'll

preface this by saying Edward is a big lighter bull. He says, "Bee beef, what is your thesis if lit gets CFDC approval and if hype does not?" Putting me on the spot. Um, yeah, I think that I think it would be weird for them to pick winners. I I don't know that the CFTC and SEC are going to roll that way. Um that would be kind of interesting. Um short term I guess you could see like because they do have some of these connections uh with getting it listed quicker like in the US or like being able to trade on it quicker in the US. But I think if you give it time and

if you see kind of what Hyperlid uh policy center is doing like they they made some noise today too pitching to the CFTC um that it's good to have the ability to hedge on different venues uh using the best technologies. Um, I think that that's great that they are they are directly pitching to the CFTC why uh hyperlquid persp like people should be allowed to to get a hold of and you know lighter uses per too. So the tech is getting recognized. Uh I think that there's you know we can go back to the whitelisting thesis like why do they why are they testing that on test net? I think that they're really doing their due diligence and making

sure that they're going to have all their ducks in a row and maybe lit sees like a move initially, but I mean, Hyperlid um I'm not worried at all about Hyperlid. Very cool, man. Um yeah, I think uh we've got we've got some fun uh fun audience members here in the chat chopping it up and uh I think you're right. Uh it would be strange for them to pick winners. I do think eventually we are going to get lighter and hyperlquid both available in the US. Both of them have relationships in the US in DC and it seems like both of them are moving along at you know very very promising rates. So uh I would anticipate that it's more likely both of these things get approved uh sometime I'd say in the next couple years uh

where they can come in and they can uh they can have a fair shot at competing with some of the biggest exchanges uh in the US and therefore in the world. >> Yeah, for sure. total agreement there. >> All right, so I got I got one more slide here and then we can get into some other fun quick news here. So we just crossed 1.2 billion in total protocol revenue. Remember, you know, this is the stuff that's being used for for buybacks. So 730 million was used for buybacks of that, which is pretty freaking awesome. >> I don't know if you heard about this.

Did you hear about this? This is fun. >> Pump Fund registered hyperlid mainet subdomain. >> Yes. Yes. No, I didn't hear about this. Tell us more about this. >> Yeah. So, this is pretty cool. Um, you know, we're the house of all finance, right? So, in my opinion, you know, some people feel differently. We need to also have memes. So, seeing somebody who the industry recognizes and that's kind of their specialty doing some of these things in the back end. Uh, what does this mean? You know, no one knows for sure. People speculate. Could this mean like they have their own version on uh Hyper EVM and then say instead of graduating to Jupiter or Radium or whatever, it graduates to purchasing a Hyper Core ticker when you reach like

certain thresholds. You know, this is like exciting stuff um that'll bring more people discovering HypereVm if it actually pans out. So there there's other stuff too that's cooking on HyperVm. People sleep on it, but I'm telling you, it's a good time. >> Huh. Very cool. Very very cool. Um okay, let's keep let's keep rolling here. I know you've got some trade XYZ stuff for us as well. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So um this is kind of interesting. There's going to be an update. It's on test net right now where they can the deployers can edit their fees now. Um which is you know people are speculating like why would they do that? What's the benefit here? I think that it makes sense like if they are doing preIPO stocks or something with a

lot more uh you know demand that they could charge a higher rate because they are like becoming the premier venue for like price discovery before they go live. And that kind of like leads into my next my next slide here. There's other theories people have here too. Uh but most of it is is bullish. I don't really understand the bearish yet. It's it they're kind of talking about someone talked about RFQ and how that can um how that might make people who are developing RFQ on Hyperlid start taking some of the volume more. I don't I don't know. I can't really speak to that. But overall, I think this is a bullish thing just giving these deployers optionality and um yeah, more options the better,

right? >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean ultimately this is another functionality for end users. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I think all of these perplexes like the more options there are the better for the end user it will be and the best you know the the platform that can build out the best product will win. All right. So, uh, Block Works, this is a great, uh, again, Shandto Devons, man, you guys got to have him on. He's a he's a great analyst for for Hyperlid, but yeah, put out this article.

>> Where's he at? Block Works. >> Yeah. Yeah, definitely worth a follow again. Uh, but yeah, so weekend markets on Hyperlid, uh, correctly priced it about 95% of the time. So that's fantastic to see just again showing the utility of these markets trading on hyperlquid especially in these volatile times. >> All right, here's the one you wanted to talk about. [laughter] So trade XYZ, >> they have now in my opinion silenced the haters and the naysayers and the doubters that were saying oh you know what happens if trade XYZ leaves Hyperlid and you know they're going to just take away all this value from Hyperlquid. Well, I think they said

something without directly saying it by using that revenue, flicking it on, and starting to buy back spot hype. And I think they've done it a few times now. So, I think that's a sign for sure. What are your thoughts on that? What do you think? I mean, look, I I think it was a massive risk to the ecosystem and to Hyperlquid's bottom line if Trade XYZ were to leave because we've been hearing so much about how much of the volume and revenue is dependent upon HIP 3 and RWA markets and non-crypto markets. And so now, you know, we know where that's coming from. It's coming from Trade XYZ.

And so because hyperlquid has become so reliant on it, it kind of gives trade XYZ leverage because now they Hyperlid becomes reliant on trade XYZ versus the other way around. And so I think people were a little bit afraid, worried, concerned that because Trade XYZ had this leverage, they were in a position where they could take that value that they were they were providing to Hyperlid and go elsewhere and build their own technology and infrastructure and internalize a lot of that. For some reason, there was also rumors that they were raising capital. Uh I think Kobe came in and kind of shut that down. And so if they were raising capital, it kind of stoked, you know, they put fuel on the fire of them potentially leaving.

That would be, you know, they would need to raise capital in order to build out the infrastructure and compete with Hyperlid. But I think this signals that's not the case. They're not raising money. They're not building out their own infrastructure. They're not going to compete with Hyperlid. and and they've got a very symbiotic relationship with Hyperlid. So, I mean, that to me just stopped in its tracks all of the FUD of Trade XYZ and Hyperlid becoming potentially competitive. As far as how, you know, their per fee revenue they're using to buy Hyperlid, I mean, I know you, you know, you came prepared with all these stats around Hyperlid, how much revenue and buybacks they're doing and whatnot. Do you have any insight into like how much money trade XYZ is

making and how much they could potentially funnel into the hyper into hype and the hyperlquid asset? >> No, that's a great question. I don't have the numbers in front of me right now, but I know that they're one of the top revenue u producing parts of Hyperlid. So, I I'll come back with it with next week with the specifics as far as the numbers for that. >> Great. Awesome. But I did want to say two things though. So this is a bullish take. You know, obviously I'm a hype maxi. So disclaimers. I think that uh as far as the raising comment. I mean if they are, they are. But I think it was more so like just taking advantage of the temporary downturn in the market that people were trying to FUD for

entries. [laughter] >> And then as far as uh uh h I forget what I was going to say, so I'll think about it. I'll probably remember in a second. That's okay. Um, that's all right. Yeah, I mean, look, a lot of this is also look uh natural market fluctuations. Uh, and then, you know, people fit narratives into what's happening in the market anyway. >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, talking about like another narrative that Hyperlid provides and makes it easy here is like builder codes. So, people who don't know, you can deploy Hyperlid as the backend and you're going to get 50% fee kickback for people using your interface. So watching the battles that are kind of uh

happening as far as these these flows and the revenue that's being produced is is pretty awesome to see. Something interesting you know the top three are Phantom Innovico and Trust Wallet. Sorry it's a little small on my screen here but um yeah no I think I think it's fun to watch. And what something different that kind of caught me off guard was Trust Wallet didn't have builder codes turned on and then they they flipped that switch and they were instantly shot up in the rankings pretty hard. So just watching these different techniques, seeing how they're getting people's eyes and attention, it's fantastic to see as just a hyperlquid enjoyer that these other companies are investing time and and

their thoughts and thinking about how they can get people's attention. So this is uh awesome in my opinion. >> Very cool. >> Very cool. Well, uh, Beef, I think we're running short on time. Is there anything else that you got here before, uh, before we let you go? >> You touched on it. Make sure you guys check out the Hyperlid Research Collective, uh, quarter two report. Super awesome. Love that data. And no, I'm just happy that uh, I got to cook with you guys again today. >> Incredible. Beef, you're the man. Appreciate you rocking with us every Friday. Give us some uh, some dubs in the chat for beef and uh, keep it medium rare, man. We'll see you next time.

>> Keep it medium rare, dude. later. >> Catch you later. All right, guys. We're gonna keep the show rolling. Next up, we've got Carl. He is the co-founder of Optimism, and we're going to bring him up uh in just a moment. You guys heard it from Beef. Everything going on in the hyperlquid ecosystem. Uh Don John keeping us in the loop. Venice having an outage. Probably going to get some FUD. Uh XYZ could be replaced. Just a validator deployer. Yeah, but a lot of the order flow does come from trade XYZ. So even if you just took them out, replace them with another deployer. It feels like it would really really impact the amount of open

interest and volume and activity that's happening on Hyperlid. Uh we don't really know until if and when that happens. Uh but that is what we are faced with. And so we got our next guest. Uh we've got Carl. He is going to join us. Why don't we get him up on the stage? I see he's ready in the back. He's co-founder of Optimism and an optimist at OP Labs. Longtime Ethereum contributor focused on scaling cryptoeconomics and open source infrastructure. Leads the development of OP stack and super chain and now powering chains for major exchanges.

Last time we had Carl on, he was chatting about his RWA strategy. And I'd love an update from Carl on that as well as everything happening in the Ethereum ecosystem. I know he's plugged in and there's just been a ton happening most recently with EIP reducing inflation and issuance. We've got him up on the show now. Carl, how's it going, man? It's good to see you again. >> Hey, how's it going? It's so good to be here. Thanks again for having me. Looking forward to it. >> Absolutely. Absolutely. Just uh man, it's been I want to say maybe few months, three, four months since we had you on last. uh would love just an update on how things are going at optimism over the last three or four months.

>> Oh my gosh, it feels like it's been forever, but that I think that's the the space moving. So, it has been a crazy few months. Um I would say some of the highlights obviously we're seeing massive amounts of increased institutional adoption as we, you know, kind of predicted. Um specifically though in APE, there's been a lot of really cool stuff. There's um KBW coming up. Um, we've had some incredible exciting, you know, successes with Etherfi and Mitsui and Toss and Upbit coming on, you know, onto OP Enterprise.

It is uh just kind of a flurry of, you know, everything kind of the center of gravity, I would say, for the kind of traditional financial system. You're starting to see the ball roll down the hill or something along those lines. I mean it feels like there's been critical mass and now it's uh this institutional FOMO that's happening at that level because uh previously it was like ah we're going to stay away from that. It would actually be sort of detrimental to their brand their institutional trust and identity if they were to go into this space because it was associated with not great vibes. But now we have all this tokenization all these efforts.

I mean you see Robin Hood, you see all of these things. they're going into this space and it sort of paves the way for institutions and actually accelerates the adoption as well that network effect and so that is what we're seeing play out. Man, I I would love just uh some insight into, you know, where they're coming from because we talk pretty broadly on the show about different asset classes, tokenized equities, tokenized deposits, native crypto assets, uh stable coins, of course, payments. What are the areas in which you're seeing the most institutional demand?

>> Great question. I think it is very safe to say that due to a lot of the kind of regulatory clarity and also the adoption just mass adoption of onchain products that we're seeing a ton of demand for tokenizing assets rwas issuing all of these assets and then also a ton of demand for creating platforms which you know like chains like the recent Robin Hood chain to then be a target for those assets that are getting issued. And so we're really just seeing a kind of expansion of the set of financial products that are accessible on chain and we're seeing that that is just increasing. You're able to transact in

ways today on chain that even a couple months ago were just fundamentally not in the cards. The kind of unit of record is moving onchain. >> Yeah, absolutely. And is there a particular area where optimism is hyperfocused and you know one of those se market segments that you're looking to dominate out of optimism? Yeah, we have definitely been very interested in issuing a large all of these RWA specifically, you know, foreign exchange, various currencies, you know, gold with um Mitsui. Um, we've been trying to find all of the right partners to then get us to have a kind of pro a suite of assets that are available on

chain with on either OP mainet or any of the chains that are in OP enterprise so that it can be a kind of well ground for organic defy adoption. >> Okay. And could you just give us a sense of like how the OP enterprise is going? How is the super chain going? You know, like what has been some recent metrics or stats as far as you know, activity volumes, revenues, just to get a broader sense of how things are going at optimism because it feels like now more than ever it's like the revenue meta, you know, like in order for these, you know, you you know, tokens to catch a bid, you got to get some revenue. And

this is just just a much more uh fundamentally focused, you know, and and honestly a more market mature and sophisticated market than we've seen in the past. Uh it feels like it's driven on fundamentals rather than hype. You know, it's like really, you know, the companies that are uh you know, looking and evaluating themselves as a real business are the ones that are catching a bid. And so tell us a little bit about you know, what the the financials look like at OP and at the OP enterprise. >> Yeah, definitely. There's definitely been a transition broadly away from the historic uh I guess vibesbased crypto experience towards an actual businessdriven strategy. And so OP Enterprise, we've

actually been able to work with a large number of partners. I just listed off a bunch that were, you know, just came out the pipe. You can scroll through our Twitter to find all of these various partners. But the short the long story short is that we are trying to source sustainable revenue with shipping products that these various customers really get a lot of value from that can then become long-term relationships that we grow over time. One of the big challenges historically with uh a lot of the kind of business models that we've seen is you know if they're based on you know onchain fee splits or whatever this is very spiky activity and so we have ended up kind of channeling our efforts

to establish business lines like OP enterprise which are a lot more sustainable and you really want to if you're getting into the crypto space if you're getting into the web 3 space you really want to work with a partner that know that is going to be there for a long time and the only way to guarantee that is to have sustainable revenues that you can build up over a long period of time and so that has been maybe the past you know eight months we basically started OB enterprise in a real way and we've already seen traction with a you know a very large number of enterprises and now it is a you know a majority of our revenue >> wow wow OP enterprise becoming a

majority of revenue more so than OP mainet uh revenue and and some of the chain revenues. >> Yeah, I mean this is it is also this predictability that we get from the revenue streams that we get from OP enterprise. It has become a really uh it's been a leveling up I would say for us and for the crypto industry at large to really be bringing on real institutions unlocking real use cases and enabling real revenue streams that have long-term predictable and sustainable uh partners >> and and OP enterprise are these I I take you know you're helping enterprises

establish their blockchains establish you an onchain offering. Are they private permissioned chains or ultimately will they become part of you know an open and composable Ethereum? >> It is a wide spectrum first off. So that includes public, that includes private, that includes everything in between. However, I actually expect that this spectrum today is very black and white. But I expect that we are going to see an increasing gradation of various types of chains with different levels of uh publicness or interoperability. In fact, I expect that these systems become a uh

depending on the use case, an institution is going to want a different type of ledger technology. And that means that sometimes it's going to be the best place to do it in a public network and at sometimes it will also be important to have private units of record. So this is I think we're starting to see a kind of expansion and a customization. Last time we were here I was talking about how customized block space is really critical for layer 2 adoption and for institutional adoption broadly. And I think that that is starting to manifest as we're working with these enterprise partners. And I think it's actually going to manifest in a really interesting way from the public

versus private debate or discussion. >> Very cool. Yeah, I mean customizable block space makes a ton of sense in these ways in which you want to facilitate institutional enterprise type transactions but at the same time you want to maintain the composability with the broad capital markets that are available on chain. We actually have a question on that note in our chat uh from our guy new type trader. He's asking how is optimism addressing the privacy layer and I think this is relevant to the institutional conversation because we've had so many points as far as you know how much they value privacy. What are you guys doing to help optimize optimism for the privacy layer?

>> Great question. So there's a whole host of technologies which offer a large spectrum of trade-offs and things that you get that are private. So I'm going to name some but I won't be able to name all necessarily. So one thing that we've talked about a lot and that has been deployed live is thing a thing called privacy boost. So what is privacy boost? privacy boost. It allows you to deploy and transact assets with privately but remain able to have a kind of compliant view of those assets which is a strong requirement for a lot of these institutions. They want it to be private from the kind of onchain perspective,

but they also want the ability to still be able to audit and make sure that the transactions comply with their various compliance needs. And so that is exactly what Privacy Boost is aiming at. I think that what we've also kind of discovered as we've gone working with all of these institutions is that there's a large number of possible privacy configurations or use cases that really I think we haven't really scratched the surface in crypto where right now we're it's like okay we've got some pools we've got some you know payments etc but what is the actual structure what institutions are going to leverage

privacy and how are they going to leverage privacy because you might have the technology but it changes its shape depending on how you use it. So are you seeing institutions transacting in large pools against you know of against onchain uh lending pools for example these are these are kind of open questions that I think we're we're starting to to discover as we work alongside these institutions. >> Fantastic. Um yeah, I mean this is ultimately where so many of the chains are positioned. Uh we're also seeing how uh there's the rise of consumer applications and finance applications.

Um and I think a lot of this has has kind of come out as of recently. There's a chart that's kind of been floating around of block works data I think and it kind of shows how for so long uh blockchains were capturing most of that revenue but more recently you have finance applications and consumer apps that are taking up a predominant uh portion of the revenue generated via this you know this transaction activity given that you know you guys are operating a chain but you've got this platform that supports such a you know a broad suite of both financial apps and consumer apps. How are you approaching this? Right? When it's the case that maybe your ecosystem is, you know, surging, profiting, doing tremendous things, the chain would have to continue

to scale, support more of these applications, uh because the the value captures a little bit less per app. So, how are you reacting to this as a as a you know, business um as the proportion of revenue that's generated via the chains and that value capture uh that proportion tends to decline? Yeah, I think that if uh it is a great sign of a thriving ecosystem that applications that are deployed on a chain are doing extremely well and investing small amounts in a chain actually yields enormous returns for all of the ecosystem uh you know participants. That is a really exciting

fact. Now, if we were to say, okay, the only way that we're ever going to make sustainable revenue is through onchain transaction fees, then okay, maybe I would be a little bit concerned about the fact that okay, maybe the the chain is capturing not uh not capturing quite as much value as uh the particular apps on that chain. But the reality is that one, this is why we have OP Enterprise. We are enabling people who need chains and two a lot of these chains are also making sure that they are deploying applications that they are enabling user experiences that are going to then be net beneficial for their ecosystem. And so I think it is a relatively uh it is a

common but it is a bit of an antiattern to look at other people's success especially if you know maybe you have a platform to look at your platform members success and say oh I should be making all of that money but the reality is that they are generating a lot of value for not only you not only them but also you and the ecosystem as a whole and so I think that this is just a natural kind of evolution. Um, I I I can see how this is maybe concerning for uh less flexible ecosystems or chains that don't just want to be chains and like don't want to innovate. But I think that ultimately it's, you know, we have to keep innovating. We have to keep delivering value. We have to keep

building products and we have to make onchain a reality. And to do that, it means innovating, building new products, etc. >> I I think it makes a ton of sense what you're saying. um you know that this is ultimately a win for the applications uh which is going to entice them more to come onchain uh and the the the reality is that it's just a bigger pie. So it's it's uh it's very very cool that these applications are doing quite well. Um and then you know obviously there's uh there's the point where you know as these as these applications come on chain they end up passing a lot of that value back to end users. Users end up sort of you know winning along along with them as well. So, it's kind of this structural shift, but then as a reaction

to this, you've also been able to monetize, generate more revenue through things like OP Enterprise. It it kind of reminds me of this concept of commoditize the compliment. I forget who initially originally coined that phrase, but it's kind of like, okay, well, if we you have this piece of very valuable infrastructure and it becomes commoditized, you know, you can still monetize adjacent parts to that infrastructure. Even though it's commoditized, it's become extremely valuable. it's integrated into so many so many of these other businesses. There's other adjacent businesses that tie into that. And so it sounds like Labs has been able to monetize, generate revenues by helping enterprises access what I mean, not really even calling out whether it's commoditized or not block

space in general, but you know, just helping access the blockchain is a a revenue path that previously wasn't there and it's not accounted for as we're looking at, you know, blockchain revenues. We're just looking at onchain revenues to your point, but there are so many adjacent business lines that can be monetized that help access that that blockchain. >> To be clear, this is in large part the strategy of developing an open-source opt make it extremely easy to deploy chains. We can then enable people to deploy chains, enable them to interoperate and form a thriving and healthy ecosystem all on top of a tech

stack that like is open source and candidly should be open source because at this point we actually benefit a huge amount for all from all of these contributions that all of these institutions are making to the stack. So this is ultimately uh It's very complicated and there's lots of variables and so it gets challenging to speak about on Twitter or on a podcast even. Uh but this is I I think an important conversation. >> Yeah. And it's uh it's very favorable for the for the health of the industry as we move forward. Another one that I think you know has gotten the people talking over recent times is uh this EIP8361 uh this issuance change you know

reduction of ETH uh inflation if we get over I think 50% of the ETH supply staked uh it would pretty much bring the uh the staking rewards down to zero obviously that would put you know a disincentive pressure for locking up any more ETH uh and then we would expect you know the the ETH uh stake to go down. And so it sounds like this proposal is trying to target like kind of a sweet spot of like I don't know 20 to 30% of total ETH staked. Can you just give us your reaction to this EIP? Do you think it's a good idea? Seems like the community kind of came out against it in force, but I'm just curious if you have that similar take and and why. I think that this EIP is a great case study in

the power of decentralized decisionmaking in that we had a proposal that was a it was a proposal. Some folks came up with it. They shipped it. It got a little bit of traction and then immediately the community looked at it and was like, "Okay, wow. this is really problematic for you know reason A, reason B, reason C, reason D and ultimately that is exactly what you want to see in something as important as multistakeholder as critical as Ethereum layer one. These are very challenging questions,

issuance, how you deal with these kind of staking and that that is a very very complicated situation. And so having that open dialogue and having a community of people that are engaging in that open dialogue, I think really just shows the kind of health of the ecosystem. even though it's a little uh devastating in some ways, you know, it's a little it's it's definitely drama and it can get you worked up and whatnot, but I think that ultimately, at least from where I'm where from what I can see and from the folks that I've spoken to, it seems like we are actually working through a relatively positive deliberation process. Now, the jury is

still out in terms of like where we land and how we land and how, you know, divisive it is. Um, but ultimately, you know, look, back, I'll tell you, back in the Dow hack, that was when there was actual deliberation. You know what I mean? That's where we really did not know what to do. Um, this one, I feel like, is much less of a crisis. >> Yeah. Yeah. I I remember. I mean, and there's still a multi-billion dollar asset out there that's just car carrying the weight of that. I would love to get some of that market cap back into the ETH, the real ETH ecosystem. Um, yeah, Carl, it make makes a ton of sense. Uh, I think, you know, the community has spoken for this one. Um,

>> anything else to share for our community as you look forward, you know, to the to the closing out of this year? Optimism seems as institutional as ever. Do you think, you know, this is the Ethereum that we're going to, you know, embrace moving forward? It's just continuing to enable more and more of these enterprises. What is that endgame? What does that look like in you know matter of months and years? What does Ethereum look like? You know, what is it? What is Ethereum in after all these institutions come online? >> I mean, look, onchain finance represents less than 1% of global finance. I think that Ethereum layer 2's op enterprise if I do say so

myself will have a major role to play in increasing the adoption for onchain settlement and increasing the reach of financial products of crossber payments of a more interconnected world as a whole and I think it's very easy to get lost in the sauce of this product or that product. And it's very hard to zoom out and look at the bigger picture where we are literally on the precipice of creating a techn technological rails that will increase the efficiency of the

most important arguably institution that we have created which is the mechanisms by which we distribute capital. So even a 1% increase in in efficiency there is a 1% multiplier on the way that we build and the way that we grow as a human race. So this is an extremely exciting time that we are able to kind of serve as the catalyst for this and see all of the kind of dreams that were kind of pie in the sky ideals starting to come true in large part that is super exciting. So you know what is the next few months? the next few months

is partner after partner, announcement after announcement, deployment after deployment, chain after chain, RWA after RWA, and we're going to see that pick up over the next few years until we realized what I think is an incredibly exciting vision. So, >> I don't know. I I'm pumped for it and we're we're cooking we're cooking on all cylinders. >> Let's go. Well, it's exciting times and uh you guys have been here every step of the way uh you know building through some of these evolutions in in the market. Uh and so we appreciate you your hard work and uh everything optimism has done for the space and for Ethereum and uh we'll be with you when uh Ethereum reaches uh endgame. We're on our way

there. We're accelerating. >> Thanks for spending some time here and uh thanks for thanks for spending all your uh your energy in Ethereum. [laughter] >> All right. Thank you for having me. This has been a blast. >> Absolutely. We'll see you next time. Thanks Carl. >> See you next time. Bye. >> All right, guys. There you have it. That has been Optimism's co-founder on the onchain economy, Carl.te. And uh I mean, he brings the energy every single time. So, we are happy to have him. Uh guys, we've got a interview with uh the Gate uh executive director. So, we're going to play that and uh we're going to uh show you guys because they're doing incredible things. They've got a new AI

that they've integrated. Uh so, just hang tight and uh we're going to get that rolling in just a moment. We have Edwin on the show. He's going to be chatting about Gates AI strategy. This is the newly promoted executive director at the Gate Group. uh promoted in July of 2026, now contributing to the overall group strategy and global business development. Gate is one of the centralized exchanges out there and uh I think they work closely with Red Bull Racing. So, we're excited to join their team in Singapore and do all kinds of fun stuff out there. Uh let's go ahead and bring Edwin up on the show.

>> Hey, thank you. Thank you, Rob. >> Absolutely. Edwin, it's a pleasure to have you. Uh we've chatted with a bunch of centralized exchanges, but it's your first time on the show. So I'd love a little bit more about your background, how you ended up finding Gate and and a little bit more about uh where Gate stands uh in the market today. >> Yeah, absolutely. Sure. So a bit of myself, you know, I head up the the team at Gate Group. So being the executive director, so basically overseeing a different, you know, business units including new stuff that uh you know, recently pop up which includes equity trading as well as you know, AI strategy. So um you know a bit of my background was that I was started from banking traditional finance where I see a lot of uh you know traditional asset

class you know and a lot of different traditional players moving to you know new digital asset space and uh I think there's a truly convergence between traditional players as well crypto players. So I think here [snorts] is how I'm you know trying trying to you know bridge the the two um you know areas and also trying to you know find the next area the next alpha uh which is obviously on the AI part and and the you know traditional equity trading. >> Yeah I mean it's been incredible to see the equity super cycle it feels like I mean the the AI capex has fueled a gigantic rally in the equities markets.

Uh it feels like AI is sort of leading uh the charge here uh and that's spilling over into crypto a little bit in the crypto AAI world. Maybe you could just tell us because we've seen so many centralized exchanges now take uh the position of building more infrastructure and exchange listings for you know real equities. Um are you going into this route and generally how are you approaching the AI trade? >> Yeah for sure. So equities you know how we we we classify as you know two different folds. One is that you know the equity trading uh which you can you know transfer your stocks you know real stocks um to the platform. So that's the the the uh traditional path and the other part is more on the tokenized

asset class. So both of them we are working in parallel you know to expand as much as possible. Um so we work with a lot of different players you know in in the in the spaces including the um clearing brokers as well as you know equity brokers to to ensure we have the trading capability in terms in different regions. So we have you know states obviously are you know very very um you know hot in the market as well as Hong Kong stores Korea all these you know AI related um stock markets. I think that's has been grabbing a lot of attention and on the tokenized you know area there are a lot of partners that we have been working with and that we're super happy that we see them grow and we grow together. Um [snorts] and these areas

are you know we we see a lot of IPOs new new you know new IPOs coming out and a lot of times it it comes up very quick in you know to getting the tokenized stocks that can actually distribute distribute to a lot of non US customers. So a lot of you know good feedbacks and you know uh momentum has been you know arising in these areas. Yeah, it it feels like we're on the precipice of something huge here because tokenization has been able to tokenize a lot of these equities and with these equities rallying as a result of the AI trade, there is a lot of demand for these AI equities. Have you seen a lot of demand outside of the US for some of these equities, some some of these asset

classes? This is something that I I love to ask the exchanges because you guys have such a a nice unique vantage point on where the flows are coming from. So maybe you could just explain a little bit more. Where are the flows coming from? Where are you seeing the most demand for these equities? Yeah. So I've been you know in flying between Hong Kong and Dubai and we I see a lot of demands coming uh you know hopping in these regions and uh you know a lot of um say you know Chinese or even Asian customers are very excited to tap into you know leading AI related stuff obviously on the states which is driving on on these kind of areas and uh the the the the demand is that it's not honestly it's not all every of the clients who

would have a you know a direct US you know account that could trade in dollar. So a lot of times not only about the access to the stocks in tokenized way but also in you know in a fiat side which is the dollar you know if they a lot of clients who are using you know their own currencies or even you know they have a lot of stable coins you know they they might as well you know just having a diversified you know asset class in in the same currency trading pairs which is the USDT or USDC. So with these two angles, we see you know the the the high demand in the um you know tokenized equities uh on on that space.

>> Yeah. Um and also part of this you know AI boom has been not just the equities themselves and the assets but how we're integrating AI into some of these businesses. How agents might be informing uh or even executing the trades on behalf of some investors. Um, I think you guys recently launched Gate AI, uh, which is, you know, where AI meets web 3, one gate to all AI. Can you help us understand how you've integrated Gate AI into the Gate exchange and how it's helping your customers execute better trades, become more knowledgeable about what they're investing in just generally, what are the user benefits of Gate AI?

>> Yeah, Gate AI is one, you know, one thing that keeps me very, very busy and the team very busy on on this new expansion. So gate AI basically we're just we are targeting not only about crypto players but also uh you know the traditional players as well as someone that aren't on the finance space basically who needs AI. So it is you know one step further to tap into anyone who needs AI having the tokens who who might just want to have a you know middle ground or a platform that could help them to source different tokens from west to east you know from from a lot of tokens you know different pricing all these you know in a one-stop shop that they can leverage by using a single API which is the gate AI router. So with

that um it's more like a new product, new services for our clients. Uh and also in the meantime, you're absolutely right that we are integrating the services into our core business which is the exchange and by how how we do that is by on the exchange trading and even you know uh the management risk management all these tools we would have AI embedded into it. We have AI summary of hey your position how how are you performing are you outperforming the market any sort of risk that you know we should be notifying you as a customers to protect yourself you know all these are embedded in if each single you know product line as well as your summary portfolio sum summary so that's one part um that we help users to do and that's

already up and running which has we using great feedback and you're also mentioning the uh trading agenic trading agentic payments abs Absolutely. There's a a a great parts that we are enhancing. We have already launched and enhancing trying to make sure a lot of agents you know who wanted to uh makes you know payments uh through agents that's already embedded with you know our our industry standard and our gate um you know agent agentic payment. >> Yeah. Um ultimately a more knowledgeable investor trader is going to make better decisions and be more profitable. Um, and so it's it's, you know, very helpful for these users to to get these AI tools integrated directly into their trading

experience. That way they can be up to-date and informed about all of the things that are happening. Some people believe technical analysis, some people believe fundamental analysis and they're looking at, you know, different metrics, but ultimately AI can help on both of these fronts and help these traders make better decisions. Since you've integrated some of these AI tools, have you seen your customers, the traders on gate, have you seen that they get better? They are they more profitable since you've integrated these tools? >> I would say profitable. I guess they they might be, you know, seeing themsel through, you know, social medias, you know, they are, you know, saying, you know, positive notes that that's how I see, you know, they are happy with that the surface. Uh what's more is that I do

see um they are now able to look into a a wider spectrum of you know coins initially I mean through human 24 hours of a day you might not have you know enough time to search different alphas or old coins in that space but you know through AI we see that you know the agents uh could help to source you know pick up all the research and uh and do the analysis uh and you know for human to make decision or even agent to make decision by themsel. So with that you know gate has been offering uh has always been offering a huge spectrum of coins um not only about you know crypto as I mentioned trefy business even commodities are able to trade all these will allow the agents you know to to

find their own you know sweet spot to to be able to trade. So that's that's how I see the the positive notes are there and a lot of time you you're mentioning um right that you know a lot of agents or people are putting on social media that hey agents can now integrate it and do their own research using their own strategy which is super cool and I'm using that I love it >> absolutely um another question pops into mind here you know you mentioned how equities commodities metals all kinds of asset classes are now you know becoming available to people on these exchanges such as Gate is proportion of trading activity that you've seen go through gate. You know, we've seen some of these decentralized exchanges, notably hyperlquid, where I think at, you know,

more than half, if not closer to like 80% of the trading volume and open interest on that exchange, is now via, you know, hit three, the RWA assets, not the cryptonative assets. Given that now you've listed some more of these RWA style assets, equities, commodities, do you see the majority of the trading volume happening on non crypto assets? >> I would say so. I would say this point. Yeah. Um I would say you know one one point to add on top of that would be more you know back then we were have been very hot in meme coins per se right NFTTS right I think these you know these hot markets more shifted to tread fivey you know hey should I be getting the

alpha from you know new newly listed stalls per se so in that case you know we do see a lot of interest uh from our customers or even on the social medias you know are saying hey the the sport business port right will be on the on the stocks market. So that um you know we will we have been seeing a pickup a huge pickup a rapid growth on on on a traditional spaces in addition to you know BTC dominance you know BTC Eve those main coins are there I think it's just a proportion you know if you we are saying that I would say this is equally I would say equally um uh important these days.

>> Yeah. Yeah. I mean it's fascinating the way that this space has developed. You know, some people are saying this isn't crypto, but this is ultimately what we all built this base for, right? It was to tokenize the world and bring the entire financial system on chain and we're doing exactly that. And you know, Gate is playing a role in that. I'm curious. >> I would say I would say in future at some point of time, it's not about whether the stocks is being tokenized or it's not tokenized. It's just about hey, who can have access to the stocks market to trade uh in which way? It's tokenized. It's just a form of the equity investment.

>> Yeah. Cert I mean abs that's absolutely the case and so how do you position gate for this new era this new generation of finance where everything comes into access everything is available all the time where do you find gate hyperfocusing is it on the equities trade or is it on AI or is it on memecoins like you know where is it that gate dominates and you anticipate that is where you're going to grow in market share relative to centralized and decentralized exchanges. Yeah. So, Gay has been you know in the market for 13 years. Um so one of the you know oldest shop in here um you know in the space.

So basically what I like the platform is that we have been very flexible and dynamic in a sense that when we have you know new back then was more about uh memecoins s just simply meme coins. We have been you know one of the the most memecoins platform that we have and now these days it's more like the very diversified you know asset class that we can trade in a platform and what's more is about the multiple jurisdiction you know we have been in compliant with different jurisdictions including Europe uh we got Mika US we have the MTL you know Australia and um you know other other regions that we have you know the we wanted to have one single brand um you know uh to to meet uh different

assets class, different clientele in different in jurisdictions um you know to capture whatever that uh might popping up in a in in a generation in a finance area. So um this is very I think the key word might be you know being dynamic you know just to make sure we always stay on the curve um up on the curve to ensure clients can can meet their financial needs um can can trade whatever they need based on their strategy through one single app. Yeah. And um you know Edwin, you joined uh at least you know in the executive director position just a couple of months ago.

>> Could you just tell us like before and after what what has now changed >> since you've joined and and taken this position of leadership? >> Yeah, so I've been at a firm for about four years. um you know the uh recently taking up an additional role is more about how to um work together with different teams not only just being silo in couple teams managing couple teams but just want to see what value could be added and across you know the the gate group so I think there has a lot of you know synergies and momentum especially a lot of very strategic partners where we have been build relationship we wanted to have one level up you know uh I just now Rob was mentioning mentioning here

but having some events with formula in during formula one rabboo all this kind of stuff is not just only about one single ROI one single product but it's about you know the user experience you know the um the journey and you know how we work with strategic partners uh to to to to level up so I think that's one one thing that um drives me keeping me um you know uh in the radar is about all this collaboration strategic collaboration in the in in this new role >> yeah very very Cool. I've got kind of this question that we typically end off on some of our guests, which is like bull and bear. Um I'm curious, you know, one of the things that uh I and I just want to get your take. What are what are some of the pitfalls? Like where do you

think other exchanges have kind of failed? What do you think has gone wrong in other exchanges? What has been like the bearish thing that exchanges have fallen into? Problems that they do that you want to avoid? And then we'll get into maybe some things that you know exchanges tend to do well that you want to succeed in. But first I'm just curious why do you think exchanges typically fail? Like what what is is there a common reason you know because recently we saw I think it was BitMart right and then it was also BitMEX you know these are exchanges that wound down. Some of this is just you know market conditions lack of volatility these guys you know they aren't able to sustain. But I'm just curious from your perspective given that you've been at the firm for a few years you've been running this business. What what do you

think is like something that you want to try to avoid that other exchanges sometimes that is the reason why you know it causes them to to not succeed? >> Yeah, I think being compliant uh would be you know first uh you know in the game to keep yourself in the game. Um and you know to get the trust from institutional players that's one um and that's also you know that's why we you know invested huge amount for in terms of compliance AML standard. uh at least you you have to take it the entrance to to get into that market in order to you know to justify yourself position yourself that's one and uh you know I I think a lot of compliant uh journey is not easy it's [snorts] not easy in a way to keep the licensing to have you know

within the the approved it activities you know you get the market you get the wallet shares uh a lot of times we wanted to avoid is uh we uh we are not We want to say avoid being un unloized meaning that we when we are we were saying we are global exchange when we come to the local market we are also localized enough I think that's very equally important especially in very in different large markets uh per se in Europe you know you wanted to have more localized advertisement you know you you know more what Europeans would want so we have a lot of local um you know colleagues constantly giving good feedbacks um how to sharpen up the market and sharpen up the the [snorts]

um the products to provide a better solutions with the um the local regions. So I would say we we keep it also being flexible and we can have you know some rooms to have different markets enabling different products in a different way. I think that's how we we keep it uh ourself unique. >> Yeah, I think it makes a ton of sense. I think that's how you maintain a proper balance of the exchange, you know, at both the global level as you operate at scale, but also at the local level to make sure that you're hitting your customers where where they are um and making, you know, making the best user experience for them. Okay. And Edwin, uh what are you most bullish on? You know, if you're looking forward the next

month, three months, six months, one year, you know, what is it? Bitcoin you're most bullish on? Is it Gate AI? What are what are you most bullish on for the next few months? I'll say the uh you know the diversification uh between you know traditional asset um uh the equities as well as on the you know bitcoin as well. So this this will keep myself bullish and uh the technology which is the AI. I think AI has changed a lot of not just about crypto but the entire industry. So that's in terms of strategy the why we call AI strategy not just about the token usage of the AI it's about this is changing our internal you know the process as well as how we deal with customers so I think that will add up and uh so I I'm very bullish in

how AI changing our habit habit or the user experience >> yeah incredible well Edwin thank you so much for joining um it was an absolute pleasure it's very cool that you guys have been able to you know make it through this bare market you've been able to survive. I think we're on the precipice of a bull market in which it's uh you know greener pastures ahead, more volatility, more volume, happier customers and uh more money for the exchange. So very very cool. Thank you so much for joining and uh we'll see you very soon in Singapore for Formula 1. >> I'll see you in person. Take care >> in person. Let's do it.

>> Cheers. >> Allighty guys, happy Friday. What a fantastic show. I mean, pretty pretty stellar lineup uh the entire week. It's pretty pretty epic. If you just look back, I think we're going to have a condensed version of all the highlights from uh from this week's stream. Uh it was pretty insane. And so, I would say that we are one of the few media companies in the space providing information, education, and alpha day in and day out uh despite apathetic market conditions. As you can see, my headphones are giving me a little bit of a Oh, there we go. We got it. Um, I mean, just continue to build build positions, build companies, stay

in the space, survive, don't get shaken out, and you guys are going to be just fine. Give me some W's in the chat. Your boy's on sound effects today. And, uh, we're going to close it out and bring you guys a fantastic weekend. We will be live on Monday uh, to start off the week next week. And that's it, guys. Stay prepped for a fantastic weekend. Should be uh should be really, really good. And uh we'll see you next week, guys. Dubs in the chat. [music]