How Helium Mobile uses crypto incentives to challenge telecom giants

Transcript

[Music] GM good morning welcome to the milk Road show The Daily crypto show where our updates are smoother than that one friend who never gets friends owned I'm your host Jay Hamilton and today we are joined by Frank Mong coo at Nova labs and helium in today's episode we are going to introduce you to one of the fastest growing deepin projects we're going to break down how their business model works and their profitability and look into their revenue we're going to explain why the helium token ticker h&t is down since the election when everything else is up you're going to be surprised by the answer and we're going to help you evaluate whether this project could be a great investment for you it's Black Friday and you know what that means it's our biggest sale of the

year and the timing couldn't be more perfect because now is when you can make lifechanging money in crypto in the next year so we are giving an incredible deer our biggest sale of the Year 40% off milro Pro this week only plus if you buy our annual membership we will throw in our crypto investing master class for free that's six hours of content breaking down exactly what you need to do to build a winning portfolio what do you get as a milro pro member you get weekly token reports breaking down your investment so you can invest with confidence you get access to the milro pro portfolio which has 12 tokens and gives you the exact allocation

percentage of each in our port portfolio you get weekly where are we in the cycle indicators that's multiple charts showing you where we are in the cycle so you can track when is time to sell when are we getting close to the top and of course you get access to the milro pro Community where there is thousands of investors just like yourself talking every day and the milro team is there giving you guys feedback answering your questions and make sure that you invest with confidence and that you know when to buy and you know when to sell and you guys come out as winners in this cycle that's what we're all about so make sure you hit the link in the show notes or the QR code on the screen and hook up this Black Friday deal incredible deal

can't believe we're doing it milkman's nuts but things are hot and we're feeling good before we jump in we need to take a moment here from our sponsors do you own your data nope every post click and search you make is controlled and monetized by unseen Giants I've had enough it's time for navigate where their mission is to give back data ownership to you and share profits with you that's right money in your pocket how you ask first the navigate browser extension makes it easy to turn your everyday browsing into passive income second the data quest game where you can boost your earnings and help train their AI visit navigate. today to earn and own your data meet uphold a trading platform

that's changing the way you think about money imagine this earning up to 4.9% apy on your US dollar no catches no lockup periods and no fees and yes it's FDIC insured up to $2.5 million they offer access to over 300 digital assets which you can trade store and exchange with confidence knowing uphold operates with a 100% reserve and a transparent model create your account fund it with a few Taps and you're ready to go click the link in the description and join uphold today welcome back okay before we bring on Frank I just wanted to take a chance

to give you guys a little bit of context about deepen and helium uh because it's a fascinating project that really uh dives into using crypto in ways that we have never seen before I'm so excited about this so first if we look at deepen which stands for decentralized physical infrastructure deepins market cap has skyrocketed market cap is O up over 400 % in the last year reaching over 20 billion and fundraising volume has also surged we're seeing fundraising up 300% year-over-year so clearly investors are excited and Builders are excited about the deepin space there's over a hundred projects building in beat in deepin right now and I'm very confident as we are at milroad that deepin is going to

be a major crypto use case in the future now as we started to take a closer look at dpen we looked at a lot of projects and the one one that really stood out to us was helium and that's why we had to get them on the show today now when we look at Helium there's one stat that really gets me excited right now and that's that since in June in June of this year helium launched their carrier offload program that's a bit of jargon basically what that allows is every day in the US there is over 200,000 mobile phone subscribers from other carriers like t- M or AT&T or Verizon that are connecting to helium hotspots and using

these helium hotspots to get better cell phone service than AT&T T-Mobile or Verizon can provide the reason is that helium provides this service in a different way than these traditional providers these traditional providers what they do is they build massive Capital intensive cell phone towers these cell phone towers cost usually around $300,000 and are very ult to build they're particularly difficult to build in cities and in high dense population areas and even if they do build them in a city let's say like next to a a major stadium that holds 100,000 people once you have 100,000 people indoors in a stadium all at once cell phone coverage

becomes crap as you guys all know you're at the t- Swift concert you can't post anything because everybody's trying to connect at the same time helium solves this problem in a very unique Way by allowing anybody to be a mobile carrier provider to Pro produce a Mobile coverage through a helium mobile hotspot so now you're in that crowded area you're in a stadium you're at a concert you're downtown New York in a coffee shop or you're in a building with a lot of people and a lot of metal and a lot of uh physical infrastructure around you that makes it very difficult for that cell phone coverage to get to that space so helium solves this problem and as I

said they launched this program which is still in beta in June and they're already seeing over 200,000 subscribers every single day use this program here's what this means if we look at the numbers there are three over 300 million mobile data subscribers in the US if just 3% of those mobile users that would be 10 million offload to helium if they use helium and each consumer on average uses about 200 gigabytes per day let's assume that 5% of that data is what they are using when they are using helium that's 10 gigabytes per user okay and if

we assume that the average cost is 50 cents per gigabyte now that can range but let's assume that's a safe assumption this could translate to over $50 million in Revenue annual revenue for helium this is absolutely huge it's solving a real problem in the US and it's going to be something that most people are not seeing because this is slow growth and most people don't know that they're using helium's coverage in this way because it still would show that you're using AT&T or using Verizon or using T-Mobile so we've got here a def a deepin project that is solving a real problem that has just started that is a is seeing incredible growth has

real users using it and that's just helium's hotspot side their other side of their business is helium mobile where they offer a $20 unlimited mobile plan and you might say that's absolutely crazy how is that possible well that's why we had Frank on the show today to dive into him explaining how they do this and explaining the future of helium which is so exciting so buckle up for us now go to Frank and introduce him to you guys Frank welcome to the milk Road Show Jay it's great to see you yeah great to see you as well let's start with user growth helium launched back in July of 2023 you guys have had incredible user growth over the last year and a half

roughly uh up to over 120,000 active users on helium mobile um how have you achieved that user growth yeah I think you know on the subscription side one of the things that we've been really trying to do is figure out if crypto can positively lower cost of acquisition so in the space of you know getting subscribers in this phone subscription Telco space the customer acquisition cost is the key to the success of that business otherwise it's a very tough and low margin business as in the United States there are I don't know hundreds of we called

mvnos um and to compete in that space it it's a it's a math game and so for us um being powered by crypto and have an incentive that is underpinned by crypto I think gives us that sort of edge I think where we really stand out there uh is really on the on the crypto side where folks on our plan uh can actively help us what we call Discovery map discovery mapping is kind of like a a technical word for really sharing your location so we understand where people tend to gather people tend to go and we use that data we anonymize it um we don't monetize it at all but we we allow

our our subscribers to opt in to sharing and if they do opt into sharing that they they earn a reward and you know that reward comes in the form of a crypto currency and you can use that reward to pay for your cell phone plan so I mean obviously you could you could also sell it or trade it do whatever you want it's a token but I I think that most people what they're doing is they're using it to pay for their cell phone plan which is giving them some people I've heard some people are getting free cell phone plans basically as a result of that oh yeah yeah it's quite quite different and quite unique in that in that way you know you can use the crypto for a number of things you can you know throw it onto an exchange or you can swap it on salana it it is

part of the salana ecosystem so it's super easy to do but you know you you can also pay for your cell phone plan uh which is quite unique when I don't think any other I think provider allows for that where you can use a Point systems to pay for your plan on a monthly basis we don't have contracts either for that matter so there's no lock in U per se so we're not trying to you know corner you in and you know we're not trying to Shackle you down for years um and I think I think that's probably the other part that you know is super unique to our plan is uh we don't sell your data we don't monetize your privacy um and we don't um we don't try to like force you to stay with us we we love for you to

stay with us because you enjoy the service and you enjoy the interface which is probably novel in itself in in the phone industry so or at least in the phone service industry I think ultimately when people look at Helium mobile hopefully it may not be right now but when you start thinking about a few years down the line I really do hope people see that the value prop of helium mobile is that the the crypto piece really reduces the cost of phone service over time that that's really our ultimate goal with this effort is to like flip the equation backwards or flip the triangle upside down where you know it the the people win and the people are

earning versus a centralized carrier I think that's sort of the you know the mission here from our perspective is you know we've got to be smart and Savvy and Leverage The crypto incentive to figure out how to reduce cost reduce the cost of access to the internet using a smartphone so that it's accessible to anyone certainly it's in the US right now but you know our aspiration is to somehow do this outside of the us as well yeah I wouldn't mind if there was a $20 phone plan in Canada that's for sure that definitely does not exist here let's just talk a little bit about understanding um profitability behind the business because the thing that you know when I

see a a $20 phone plan I'm like how is that possible like is that is that profitable is helium profitable right now is the obviously one of the things that you're avoiding is the massive infrastructure cost that a lot of Telos have to take on so maybe that's how you're able to offer such a a lowcost plan walk us through how the numbers look and how they work so that we can understand that yeah I can I can talk to it at a high level you know we're private companies so we don't disclose details of our financials but you know it it we don't think about profitability today yet um because we're not quite there yet I think one of the things we

look at and we have access to is certainly we're Venture backed so we are you know in a way we have cash on hand to operate the business on the other other side of that because we are a service provider helium mobile is a service provider on the on the helium Network itself we we do earn crypto for providing a service and building on top of the healing ecosystem and so we we do have a treasury of crypto we don't use that treasury for operations we use it for incentives we use it for phone plans and so we we really do try to be smart about how we balance both our operating expenses as well as you know Promotional and expense as it relates to customer acquisition or customer retention

and so right now it's a balancing act for us to ensure that we have Runway to achieve our objectives and and so as I go back to like you know first principles of this business which is we we call it CAC CAC customer acquisition cost um the goal is to get that to zero right we've been hovering I would say um anywhere between I I want to say like $20 per sub and at times it's been as high as a 100 just for your investors you know on average when you look at Telco CAC um it's about in that $50 to $100 depending on the brand so the large brands that everyone knows the big three or so

they're probably operating in that $100 range but they're putting ads on you know Super Bowl and they're doing tv ads and outdoor ads so it's quite expensive for them to acquire customers um but they also charge a lot if you if you will right you mentioned $20 plan be would be great those big three are in Canada the big two you know they charge quite a bit uh it's not $20 right anywhere from1 to $200 right so it's an order of magnitude more but it's expensive to run their operations Beyond customer acquisition costs they own infrastructure each cell tower costs about $300,000 us to put up uh that doesn't take into account ongoing maintenance so quite quite a bit of

investment there as well so I don't blame them for being so expensive but they're carrying a heavy burden as they as they drive their business so our objectiv is to figure out how to be smarter we're Outsiders coming in how do we think differently about this how do we leverage crypto uh and and really that's that's what we do all day is to look at that cap number and keep keep driving it lower and lower right so that's our objective so I I think when we think about expenses that that's one big side of it the other big side of it is is of course people we try to operate as efficiently as we can on the people's side U th you know those are costs that you know we can't avoid we have to developers and customers support so those are very important to

us um so I think from our perspective if we can you know the trick here is I think in the magic is if we can get the ca down really low and we can continue to sustain growth on subscription I think that becomes quite interesting in a market that hasn't been able to do that if you look at some of the other brands out there they need celebrity endorsements or they need to do TV ads those are all multi-million doll efforts um so our objective is not to spend multi-million dollars but yet see the results right of of subscribers coming on board and the other side of this is really the network using the helium

network is is novel in the space that we're in no one else uh really has that ability where individuals can put up many cell towers and when we when we think about putting up many cell towers we're talking about building networks and so we have a a community very thankful of helium deployers we probably have thousands maybe tens of thousands of deployers you know in our in our Discord channel of 120,000 people that all they focus on is how do I get small businesses malls amphitheaters concert Halls how do I get them to put in the healing mini cell tower this little healing hotspot and that we're talking

about taking a $300,000 piece of technology shrinking it down to anywhere from $200 to $400 I mean that's that's sort of the other side of of this equation where it's magical like let's figure out how to do that so that you have a very lowcost highly localized Network that you that works really well indoors and that in that case that's you can think of that as a augmentation or it's a supplemental Network to the existing cell network cell networks are great for outdoors when you're outside you're always connected but once you're inside and you're at a Taylor Swift concert nothing works we all we've all

experienced that when you go to a concert you want to upload your stories because it's a great Vibe gosh it isn't connecting so why is that well because you've got like you know 70,000 people all trying to do the same thing and you've got a couple of cell towers there trying to handle the load and that just doesn't work but that's where I think something like a healing mobile hotspot indoors is is magical and this this applies to coffee shops bars and you restaurants or malls where you just have you know aggregation of people during certain times of the day and the network gets loaded on the sell side so this idea of offload I think is pretty incredible and to enable individual to do this I think is something that we

really haven't seen before of course the rewards are in crypto as well and that's I think those are some really novel things where we figured out how to switch between our partner T-Mobile which is a you know National carrier here in the United States um leverage their Network when we have to which is like parents taking kids to to soccer or to violin lessons you're going to be driving around you need a cell tower there's no I don't I can't find another way out of that other than starling once phones can connect to to satellite but before then you got to live your life um and I think that's that's where T-Mobile adds a lot of value once you get into the venue you're with a lot of people and you want to use social media that's when you start to see the signal isn't

as great you're sitting in a a metal building which is like a fair day cage so then the indoor cell tower becomes super important there I think that's where that's where a lot of the healing Network adds a ton of value and it really supplements that yes so much to so much to unpack there Frank I'm try to take this one point at a time uh first on the on the CAC customer acquisition cost uh this is a concept that I think people are not realizing how big it is going to be in the next decade you guys are leading the charge here you're one of the first to really use this model of can we use crypto incentives to lower customer acquisition costs and rather than spend money on traditional

marketing and web 2 marketing and billboards and celebrities instead let's spend that put that money into back into our customers hands let's give them incentives and make them the marketing engine and make them uh value being part of it and so I think that's that's huge and we're GNA see that we're gonna see that in gaming we're GNA see that across all different categories um and it's going to flip marketing totally flip marketing around in a in a very positive way in my mind um when you mentioned the uh the helium Network and the mobile hobot I want to talk more about that but before we go there I just want you mentioned T-Mobile what's the why why what's the benefit to T-Mobile to partnering with you that's one thing

that I like to me T-Mobile would say hey you're a competitor we don't want to partner with you and give you access to our Network like that seems so what's the benefit for that yeah I you know I think there's two pieces there with the T-Mobile relationship um some of your investors may not uh recall but T-Mobile which is the deuts out of Germany is an investor in Nova labes healing Mobile in our series D round and that's the parent company of T-Mobile USA and so on the one hand they they invested in us so you know we we meet with the we met with their CEO you know we have conversations with their teams on a fairly regular basis and I think that's that's what investment in

us gets them access to so perhaps they they want Insight insight into how we think and how we behave and uh the other aspect of that is that they're international company and we're only in the US market so yes in a way we are disruptive potentially to their business model but it's in a it's in a very specific market for them in the USA not not there other markets in in the International Market at least for now and I think I think the other side of it is you know when we went out and looked at a partner for the macro Network for the large Nationwide Network here um we talked to everyone we talked to the top you know the top three providers in the USA and so in in those conversations

you know I would say maybe it was the investment relationship but we we got probably the the best deal from T-Mobile USA out of the other uh the other carriers and so we we that we did that in an independent way um and that decision is really and that relationship is really us uh buying data from their wholesale business and that and that's something that's a regular occurrence when I say that I mean like other mobile providers like mint mobile has done the same thing you know they partnered with T-Mobile and they purchased data access on their cell network through their wholesale team so we're very close with the T-Mobile wholesale team because we

are a customer of theirs and you know we buy data from them so so in a sense they're happy to take take our money right they're happy to take us as a business and we are definitely doing this in a very novel way and so they they want to see how this works you know and the good news is you know they're they're rooting for us they're I think they're fairly Innovative when it comes to you know large telecommunications companies and so they're quite interested in our model and and how we how we proceed and how we progress Frank one thing that uh we noticed when we looked into uh h&t token uh which is the the main token that if you wanted to invest in helium that's the token you would hold it's down since the election which is a bit eyebrow raising because

everything is up since the election in crypto and so any idea why it's down since the election yeah I I I had the same like question as you and I don't remember if this is in our community Discord uh so for your investors that don't know there's a Discord channel uh discord.gg helium is where you can find the community now usually there's not a lot of talk about token price in fact I think it's not allowed but I think there was a channel that's just for token price if you have to talk about it or this was on X I can't remember which so you have to do a little bit of searching but I did that and I found someone posted a link to a wallet address where

there were two massive sales of 1.2 1.5 million h&t so roughly 7 eight to8 million worth of h&t where they sold two times in two tranches over the last you know 10 days or so and allegedly that wallet belongs to the FTX bankruptcy uh admin and so if you think about what's happening with FTX in the case in the bank bankruptcy trial the admins had to liquidate all assets to pay back uh their customers and I didn't even know FTX had h&t but I guess it might make sense because helium wasn't uh helium had his own L1 if you look

back in history and so maybe FTX did a wrapped h&t of some sort on salana which required you to put a bunch of h&t in and you would get some wrapped h&t out maybe over that time they accumulated h&t and you know with the bankruptcy you have to liquidate so that's the that's the explanation and that's sort of at least what I've seen yeah so so nothing to do with thought to be honest when I thought I was like is this a regulation issue like is Trump somehow going to like regulate uh decentralized dpin or something which seems crazy because Trump would would definitely be in support of dpin I would guess he'd be in support I mean supports crypto and he

just supports General Innovation uh and anything that is good for the economy which deepin really is uh so very interesting so it's nothing to do with the election this is just a total coincidence that somebody that the FTX creditors had to sell a bunch of helium tokens right around the same time and as a result in the last 14 days helium's down 14% I think it actually got as low as um like a a low it was as low as5 and a half doll the token um which was quite a drop interesting so this just a supply issue very interesting so uh yeah you guys listening in you know what we think about supply issues like this one time supply issues uh this could be a bargain

price opportunity guys Frank you don't need to say anything about that that's my opinion not yours awesome wow very very interesting thanks for clarifying that for us Frank I want to talk about the carrier offload program because this is a key program for you guys in for many ways but it it also it has the potential to bring a lot of Revenue down the road it's just in beta right now and it's it's new so but can you explain the carrier offload program and maybe your vision for like where it could where you think it could go in the future yeah you know I think the so the carrier offload program that we're running in beta right now I think the

simplest way to think about it is this helium Network that individuals are building this mini cell towers indoors has the ability to actually connect not just healing mobile subscribers but really any cell phone subscriber including the top three 18 T Verizon and T-Mobile and would that Sor Frank just a quick question would that happen automatically or would I automatic it's automatic okay it's it's automatic there's technology standards that exist where um a cell phone has certain credentials and so everyone has this doesn't matter who your provider is your cell phone has something called a

certificate and that certificate's tied to to the eim this gets very technical into your phone but the way your phone works is everyone has a sim a physical Sim that goes into the side of this phone or there's an eim that's software based that goes into the phone so Apple Samsung uh Google they they've all got this standard and this is global every every carrier every cell carrier does this and so whether you know it or not it it's there that eim or that physical Sim has something called a certificate and that certificate is how your phone authenticates into a network once it walks in so once you're coming to United States you got a bunch of different

carriers your e will be recognized by a cell tower we've created a situation where our hotspots can recognize your certificate and if we have a partnership with that you know your carrier so if your carrier is AT&T Teo Verizon and you come into the vicinity of our Network and we have a Rel relationship with them this offload relationship then your phone will automatically just continue to work indoors and just connect this is especially important if you're in an indoor environment you're in a inner city with lots of buildings like New York City Manhattan is a great example

buildings everywhere Concrete Jungle you're going to a coffee shop you're surrounded by Massive buildings that is a natural landscape for bad cell coverage indoors it's just doesn't matter what you do the concrete the metal just creates Havoc for sell signals for getting into that coffee shop so as a customer of any of the big cell phone providers you you want you want you want it to work you want to be productive you want to use your phone connect to the internet and that's just not possible if you go into that coffee shop and so rather than having spotty service some coffee shops have Wi-Fi some don't you just don't know then this certificate idea with a healing mobile

hotspot it just works you walk in the AT&T signal the Teo whatever signal it just continues to work who really well who are you partnered with on the carrier we great question we haven't announced the names of the of the carriers um we've partnered with two out of the three or four big ones in the US and we haven't announced it because we haven't gotten permission and so you know it your investors probably know this there's something called NDA non-disclosure we sign that and so we can't disclose unless we get permission and we haven't gotten permission not that we don't want permission we certainly do um it's but right now it's yeah I mean right now it's just showing

and demonstrating that the technology that we've built works well it scales well it's consistently working well and that's the key right so rather than us worried about you know whether we have uh NDA or not or are we allowed to say it or not the focus is let's just make sure this stuff works really well and let that let the performance speak for itself and over time as we become very reliable I think I think a lot of these big carriers will be happy to talk about it we just but you know we just have to prove ourselves continu so so so so map this out for me like like a few years down the road let's go down the road and um let's just assume that all carriers

all big Telos in the US are using your care offload program probably because they don't really have another option they aren't good at infrastructure in these indoor spaces they they're not gonna put a $300,000 cell phone tower in a stadium or something like that that seems maybe they will but uh so so they they have benefit to partnering with you you are solving a problem that they can't solve themselves how does money flow here do they they pay you every time one of their customer cell phones automatically comes on the helium Network yeah so behind the scenes this uh this idea of offloading to to somebody else's Network that was cool isn't it uh has been tried

in the past and I think um you know how we work with each of these carriers is is a negotiation like how much data do they want to offload um how much are they willing willing to pay per gigabyte um those are all economics that we're we're testing that's what we're beta we're still negotiating some of these rates with these guys um you know we're trying to figure out you know how much we can get of course and of course they're trying to figure out how little they can pay right so that's sort of that's the game in in in everything supply and demand right and so I think for us that's an ongoing thing right now and that's why we're in beta but the other consideration for for them is they they don't want this to be flood you

know Fly by Night they want this to be scalable they want a solution that they know can work and so today they select so we we have a a network of gilan mobile hotspots indoor C towers and outdoor ones around the country in United States I think it's like 25 or 27,000 hotspots out there now um and the carriers these large carriers they will go and pick and choose which ones they want to offload and and to be fair they actually have a fairly rigorous process just because a person puts a h spot you know up doesn't mean they get selected if they put a hotspot up in their home

they're not going to get picked the cell tower guys have no interest in using your house but if you put it in a coffee shop right and there's like 300 people a day that come through or you put it in a near next to a stadium where there's basketball games with like 70,000 people you're going to get picked right so so like that's sort of like that's sort of how I think that mindset works because that's where the need is is where there's a lot of people Gathering there's a lot of load on their cell network and they need to offload that load to another Network that's where we add value so you know I I I say this because I think some of your investors also love to put up Min cell towers they're probably putting up helium

hotspots with us with within our community which is great but just remember like pick commercial businesses lots of people loitering or moving around those are the best places um because because that's where the the need is right so you you want to go where where there's need and you're solving a problem and that's and that's sort of how it works behind the scenes and so in a in a way we we really can't control who gets picked we can propose like oh these hotspots have selected themselves to be in the beta program and it's really up to the carrier Partnerships that we have for them to pick and then once they pick those they Define you know we're negotiating terms

but a lot of times they'll tell us okay well for that we'll pay you this for that we'll pay you that so it becomes like I can't I don't know what the exact number is because it's it's like variable payment depending on need you know so in a higher demand area they pay more a very low demand area they pay nothing or they don't want it period and so that's sort of where we're at right now with these you know these networks amazing so and and clearly that has the potential to generate if this works and if you if the helium Network continues to grow if you have more of these providers these this people powered Network people putting up hotpots in these commercial areas in areas uh where there's heavy traffic I mean you guys just announced a big

partnership with aaban you guys are really expanding the network rapidly right now this could be a large Revenue generator for for he it could be yeah and I think it definit could be and I think the way we look at the metrics today in the current phase that we're in I think the two key metrics that are super I would encourage you know your audience to look at is first the amount of data transferred and that data that is important because you want to see the amount of data that's flowing through the helium mini cell towers and you can go find that on Dune so Dune is like a dashboard company that shows a bunch of

like yeah great they know Dune so go to Dune and search helium data credits three words and there's already a a dashboard they can look at and the one that I think is really important to keep track on is the mobile data transferred in terabytes that's key that's how we that's how we we measure this internally like for us we look at that I look at that every day like I look at that like multiple times within the hour because I I want to see how much data we're moving per day from the right now from the hotspots So today we're moving like about we're averaging about 10 terabytes per day of data so what

does that mean that's like that's a lot of Netflix streaming that's a lot of YouTube that's a lot of Instagram stories and Snapchatting but that's that's what it means if you ask chat GPT I can give you some examples right that's what I tend to do when I tweet I'm trying to find a way to articulate this right and that's important because you we're building a useful Network and you want to demonstrate usage and so the amount of terabytes is is a critical number that we look at on a daily basis today we're we're hitting 10 fairly easily every day our our goal is to like get to 20 30 40 100 terabytes like aspirationally we can get to a pyte a day that's massive because at two pedabytes a day that's about a million

dollars a day of of transactions on the chain generated by our users with yeah that's that's h&t data credits that's getting burned a million bucks a day so so that terabytes to petabyte journey is super important that's like that's one the second thing to look at unfortunately I don't think it's in in Dune at least I haven't found it yet but if your audience knows like please like tweet it at me um I want to know because the other one to look at is like just the amount of daily users hitting the hotspot this includes helium mobile users it includes we've got three carrier Partners now can't name them but

carrier one carrier two carrier three there four actually I don't know why this carrier four so there's four so uh there's four and it's called carriers if you use the Planner tool we have too many tools by the way I know sorry you guys have incredible tools and stats you got your website's oh God RIT too many it's a rabbit hole but when you go to planner. heloh helium.com there's you scroll down there's a area called like total carrier offload look at the daily subscriber number like today it's like 230,000 or something so yeah we we've been roughly in that 230 I think we even popped to like close to 300 if not I

think we exceeded 300,000 but that that's important because that tells us that the network that we've put in in place is is in good area is in areas where there's a lot of people like I mentioned earlier yeah you want a useful Network well you got to put this thing where there's going to be people Gathering and so 230,000 to 300,000 per day is is great and we want to see that go up obviously um and this is a combination of all subscribers this is why I think the carrier offload becomes very interesting because now now you're actually adding value not only to helium in our mobile users we're we're also adding value to to other networks and so again that these are like the really the

metrics on the other side of that you can see the offload data in in terabytes now that's great but that's like total that's a total number I think since Inception of that's not daily this is just total no I think it's total yeah yeah so that's that's great but I I like to see progress on a daily basis we're pretty like we're maniacally focused on this so I get very fanatical about that number like daily number so for for the team out there for the folks watching if you want to participate you want to help us out like these are the metrics to look at how many Subs are we getting um both not just ours but you know other carriers we're able to offload for and then what's that data per day look like and that's on Dune somewhere I don't

know if you can pull the Dune up but anyway we'll throw a link to dashboard in the show notes for anyone want check it out while yeah yeah so while I know revenues important for most uh folks that are doing the calculations and looking at this um I I I think right now the revenue isn't as important to us it's it will of course is important but it's not the most important metric that we look at it's really amount of terabytes per day transferred and you want to see that go as high as possible and obviously our mission is to get it to pedabytes which is massive by the way and then the other piece is just the num pure number of subscribers from all carriers hitting our Network work and latching on incredible yeah incredible

uh Frank this has been a wonderful conversation very insightful to learn about what you guys are building and the way you're approaching disrupting uh a one of the largest Industries in America uh really excited to watch you guys over the future and I think we'll have to get you back on in uh in about maybe six months or a year or something like that to give an update on your progress because you guys are just doing so much as I mentioned we'll link we'll have a bunch of links in the show notes of this one as well as linking to our Pro report if you guys want to go deeper into the investment side of understanding uh how we think about helium from an investment perspective Frank thanks so much again for joining us today appreciate it thank you have a wicked awesome day everybody

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