Crypto Bubble could Take Down Trump

Transcript

Intro

One thing that Bitcoin has done is a lot of people know what fiat currencies are. They never knew before Bitcoin. I mean, it was very few people had ever heard the term fiat. Now I hear it all the time. I think, you know, he's going to have to walk away from the whole crypto thing. Otherwise, it's going to take down his presidency all by itself because there's a big bubble in crypto. Uh, a lot of people are going to lose a lot of money. Some of them might blame Trump. And I think the central bank rotation out of dollars and treasuries into gold is [music] going to continue. The skeptic in me is probably that maybe Donald Trump was told by somebody that that's not a good idea because we don't have all that gold and we last thing we want is the world to recognize that cuz

that will be a big problem for us. The AI bubble is bigger than the crypto bubble. But the crypto bubble I [music] believe is bigger than the dot bubble. So you're talking about some massive bubbles when you combine them into a super bubble. Hello everybody and welcome back to Reinvent Money, a podcast about money and power. I'm your host Paul Bountick and I'm very pleased to welcome back on the show the legendary Peter Schiff of Shiff Gold in Europe. Hi Peter, how are you?

>> I'm good. How are you today? >> Yeah, not too bad. you must be having a field day with gold up this year like 60% and Bitcoin down this year. Uh gold has been the top performing major asset in Bitcoin like the worst. So um that must uh be a great feeling for you. >> Um well you know I'm not exactly doing a victory dance just yet but things seem to be going uh you know going in my direction and I expect more of the same uh next year in particular. I think I think goal is going to have another very strong year. Um, I think the miners are going to do very well. I think the dollar is going to be a lot weaker in 2026 than it was in 2025. The dollar weakened in the first half of the year, but so far it's kind of been treading

Peter's forecast for gold, dollar and crypto in 2026

water. I expect it to really sink in 2026. Um, I think the Fed will, you know, be back doing QE by then. So, we'll even have easier monetary conditions which will favor gold. And I think inflation is going to be accelerating which will uh disadvantage bonds. So, I think, you know, you'll see more safe haven money flowing out of US treasuries into gold. Uh, that's going to be great for the miners, which I think are already much too cheap. And I think the central bank into gold is going to continue.

And I think what we're going to also see is a rotation out of crypto into gold. The only problem there is there may not be much to rotate because as people try to get out of Bitcoin, uh, there won't be a lot of buyers. So, I don't know how much money they'll be able to salvage from that busted trade, but I think you're going to see uh a big blow up in the crypto market in 2026 as the air really comes out of that bubble. >> And you're supposed to um speak at the Binance blockchain week early December and Michael Sailor is going to speak there as well. Are we going to see debate between the two of you?

Peter's thoughts on Strategy and Michael Saylor

>> Well, you know, I challenged him again. He's been ducking me for years. You know, when I was at the Bitcoin conference in Las Vegas, they tried to organize a debate between me and Sailor because he was there, too. In fact, when he gave his main talk, he mentioned my name twice. I was the only person he mentioned, but um he he he refused to debate me. It was just he didn't want to do it. So, I debated some lightweight, right? I I forget who it was. mean no disrespect to whoever I you know debated but it wasn't Sailor and and so I threw out a challenge on on X and I said hey you know Michael I'm going to be at the blockchain week Binance blond shake week

in Dubai we're both going to be there I want to debate you on a different topic I don't want to debate Bitcoin or gold the topic I want to debate is I believe Micro Strategy the whole business model is a fraud I think the company's going to go bankrupt. And I want to debate that. I want to debate Micro Strategy. Forget about Bitcoin, right? I want to debate the the the validity of his business model, which I think is flawed. And I think he's going around telling people stuff that's not true about about his company. So, I threw that gauntlet down. I I doubt he's going to pick it up. But I will be debating CZ, who's not afraid to debate me at all. And in fact, the whole debate between me and CZ, what set that up is I did another Bitcoin

Peter's debate with CZ and Binance about tokenized gold and third party risk

podcast or crypto podcast and I started talking about my tokenized gold product, which I don't have yet. I mean, it's I'm going to do it, but I've launched uh t-old.com, which is now just part of the shift gold website. And right now, initially, you can go to t-old.com and you can buy gold and silver and we'll store it for you. uh you you know it's your gold that's stored you know in a facility with your name on it. You can sell it whenever you want and and take whatever profits you you you may have or you can hold on to it. Eventually, you will be able to withdraw it in my tokens and uh once I develop them, but even before I get to the tokens, I'm going to try to pair up with a bank so that you

can get a debit card or a a credit card secured by your gold. And I want to open up peer-to-peer transfers so that customers of of Shift Gold can exchange gold back and forth with one another uh as a medium of exchange. You know, you can gift your gold or you can spend your gold or more importantly, you can earn gold, right? If I have an account, I want to earn gold. Let me invoice my customers. Let me get some gold, you know, for my goods and services if I'm running a business. So I really want to try to help uh you know get people to use gold as not just a store of value but a mean of exchange. So when I started talking about tokenized gold that's when CZ went on X and he said tokenized gold is bull you know because

you have to trust a third party to hold it. And he said so it's like trust me bro. And then I uh replied and I said well first of all what's Binance? Binance is a third party. plenty of people have their their crypto with Binance. Is that a, you know, is that a mistake? Uh, but I also said that I don't think there's anything wrong conceptually with having a third party that you trust with your gold. I mean, plenty of people trust third parties with their cash right now. You trust a third party with a stable coin. You know, when you have a Tether or USDT, right? You're trusting somebody to hold your dollars, >> right? So, the whole stable coin

industry is built on a foundation of trust. >> Uh, and there's plenty of industries that are based on trust in capitalism. Insurance is a great example. People buy insurance, but it only works if the insurance company pays you. You got to trust that when you put in a claim, they're good for the money, right? They, you know, >> I also want to challenge him about his cozy relationship with Trump and and and him being pardoned by Trump. sensitive. >> Look, I'm I'm I'm happy that, you know, the guy's uh you know, first of all, he already served his time and he paid the the p fine. So, you know, the pardon helps. Uh but, you know, he already, you know, he already suffered the

consequence. I'm sure he got railroaded. I mean, the government, you know, does this to a lot of people. I've been victimized by our government, too. So I most likely, you know, you know, he didn't he wasn't guilty of the moneyaundering and he just ced a plea just because it, you know, it was easier. I know how the government shakes you down. Uh there's a lot of corruption in the US government, but I'm not there to debate CZ about that. Um I want to debate the premise of gold uh Bitcoin versus tokenized gold because after he said that, I challenged him. I said, "Hey, let's have a debate. let's debate Bitcoin versus tokenized gold. And he said, "I accept." And then a day or two later, he said, "Hey, let's do it in

person. Why don't you come to blockchain week?" And that wasn't what I initially had in mind. I was like, you know, let's do it on, you know, YouTube or X. But, you know, I I'll do it. What the hell? I mean, I haven't been to Dubai in a couple of years. Uh, you know, I I enjoyed my time at the Vegas Bitcoin conference. You know, I thought about staying the same company as doing another conference in Abu Dhabi the week after blockchain week, but I'm going to skip that one because I committed to doing a gold conference in your neck of the woods in Amsterdam.

>> Right. Yeah. I I heard about it. Amazing that you come this way. >> So maybe you'll be there. Maybe you'll be at that conference. >> Be there. Yeah. The good thing is like whether people like you or not or agree with you or disagree with you, at least you always say yes to a debate. of course, not like any person, but you always like to defend your position and um and I think people appreciate it about you. >> Yeah. I mean, I've I've had these debates with most of the big people in crypto. The two that have ducked me have been Michael Sailor and Mike Novagrats. I don't know. Maybe it's something about the mic. I don't know. But those are the two because I've I've wanted to bank debate Novagrats a few times. I said, but he has he said publicly he has no

Why Peter really doesn't like Bitcoin

interest in debating me. Uh but most of the other people that are, you know, pretty, you know, high-profile in the industry are happy to do it, you know. >> Yeah. And I whenever I tell someone that I'm going to talk to you and of course they they know you're you don't like Bitcoin, but there's still a lot of people saying, "Yeah, it's just it's just a play. He he he just uh he owns Bitcoin, but he just drives down the price in order to buy him on a cheap or whatever." But I said, "No, I think he's a convinced anti- Bitcoiner for a long time. It's not some sort of game he's playing." >> Yeah. Well, first of all, nothing I say is going to drive down the price of Bitcoin. I mean, no one cares what I say about Bitcoin. Uh, so if that was my

goal to drive down the price, you know, that's it's not it's not working. Um, but um, no, I mean, people have kind of come up with some crazy theories. And I think it's because a lot of people who own Bitcoin, obviously, they're convinced that they're right, right? that there there's no doubt in their mind that it's going to the moon and they share a lot of the same concerns that I do uh you know at least the hardcore Bitcoiners right uh and in fact a lot of those guys own Bitcoin because of me in fact that's what everybody was telling me at the conference I went to in Vegas in May I you know people kept coming up to me and saying you're the reason I own Bitcoin you're the reason I

own Bitcoin uh even though that wasn't my intention but what happened was I educated them about economics, Austrian economics, sound money, gold, the Fed, all that. And as a result of me putting them on that path, they ended up at Bitcoin, right? So, but they still credit me because if it wasn't for me, they never would have got on the path that took them to Bitcoin. >> But again, I like about this all this alternative space like people get into uh Bitcoin because they first got into gold, but there's plenty of people that now get into gold because they first got into Bitcoin. So in a way both of the of these these spaces are they they both agree on the fact that our current financial system is unsustainable and

Gold vs bitcoin

they're looking for solutions. So there's just so much more that these different groups have in common that it's a pity that they're always so much also battling each other in a way because they're both >> well I mean to the extent that Bitcoin leads people to gold that will be one positive development. In fact one thing that Bitcoin has done is a lot of people know what fiat currencies are. They never knew before Bitcoin. I mean it was very few people had ever heard the term fiat. Now I hear it all the time. So at least you know it's it's been resurrected and people people people understand it. But you know when I was uh at the Vegas conference and I went to I talked to David Bailey who you know owns a Bitcoin magazine and host the conference. I said you know David >> I'm responsible for more people at your

conference owning Bitcoin than anybody else. And he said yeah I know you're the reason I own Bitcoin. So, you know, that's like a common thing. But the reason that so many of these people just assume that I must secretly own Bitcoin is given the fact that we have so much in common and they're so convinced that Bitcoin is great, how can I not know this, right? That that doesn't even make any sense to them that I wouldn't agree with them. And so the only way I guess to to square that is well he must be buying it secretly and this is all part of an act. And it was funny when my son started talking about Bitcoin they thought yeah I had him up to it and I'm

buying all this Bitcoin through my son and I'm which is all nonsense but because they don't want to accept the fact that I legitimately don't like it. I don't believe in it. I think it's a scam. I think it's going to collapse. It's a decentralized Ponzi, a pyramid scheme. They they can't accept that I believe that. But I do. But the fact that I believe that is, you know, a threat to the whole system because the system is based on a shared belief. What gives Bitcoin value is the fact that there's a community of people who think it has value. And it's that belief and confidence system that is the total source of whatever Bitcoin's got. But in order for Bitcoin not to collapse and in

fact to keep going up in price, the community of believers has to constantly increase, you know, that's why they're constantly prophetizing, right? They're like the Harry Kursers of the investment world because you have to you have to keep bringing new converts in. And one of the reasons that Bitcoin likes to trash gold is because they're saying that it's an alternative to gold. It's better than gold. We don't need gold. In fact, some of the most ridiculous things I hear about gold come from the Bitcoin community. It's a worthless rock. It doesn't have any value. I went on to the spaces the other day and there was some guy on there thinks he's so smart and he says, "Well, you know, if it wasn't for gold being money, it would be about $50 an ounce." It has. He goes, "It's

useless." $50 an ounce. He's like, first of all, it costs $1,500 an ounce to mine it. So, if gold was at $50 an ounce, there'd be no more gold, right? Nobody would be digging it out of the ground, but the demand would skyrocket because if you could buy gold at $50 an ounce, people would use it. They wouldn't even use copper. They would just use gold for everything if it was that cheap. So, it's like it can't be there. They don't understand that the the value they the guy was saying, "Well, gold has no use. There's nothing you could do with it." Like, what what do you mean? It's got more uses than any metal we got. What do you people have no appreciation uh for gold in the Bitcoin community now? Not all, you know, not all of them. I think it's changing, >> but the reason the reason I'm against

Bitcoin, and it's not that I'm just trying to sell more gold. People say, "Ah, you're just a shill. You know, you want people to buy gold." Yeah, I do want people to buy gold, but I don't want people to buy Bitcoin thinking they're buying gold. Because they're not, you know, I want people If people want to buy Bitcoin, doesn't bother me, but I want them to understand what they're buying. They're buying a highly uh speculative token that has no real relationship to gold whatsoever. It's not a digital version of gold any more than a an image of a hamburger is digital food. You know, it's not you, you know, if you had a diet of digital food, you would starve to death. So, Bitcoin is not gold. They can draw a coin and color it gold, but that doesn't

make it gold. Uh you can't conduct electricity with it. I can't make, you know, a bracelet out of it. you know, I I you know, I can't do anything with it. Um, but it is a highly speculative token that people collect and to the extent that more people want to collect Bitcoin, the price could go up. So, you can make money speculating in Bitcoin. But it's not gold. It's very different. So, if you're just looking for a store of value, an inflation hedge, a safe haven, you don't consider Bitcoin. Just look at gold. Yeah. But if you think, but if you're looking to speculate, if you think Bitcoin just might go to 500,000 or a million and you want to throw some money there because you think that's going to happen, you could do

that. I just don't think it's a good bet at this point. I mean, I I I just think there's a lot of downside risk now and I think there's better upside potential. I'd rather buy gold mining stocks. People say, "Why don't you just put 1% in Bitcoin?" I'd rather put an extra 1% into gold mining stocks if I want to gamble. I think there's better odds there. I like I like the uh the asymmetry of that trade better. I think I got a lot of upside uh relative to the downside. Yeah. Let's talk a bit more about the gold because um we we all know of course there was this amazing rally. I'm still trying to figure out what was driving the October um rally or basically the whole year we we've seen this this uh super increase in price.

Why central banks are behind the gold rally

Was it the Chinese central banks ETF inflows? Because if I look at coin and bar sales in the US, it's actually going down for four quarters in a row now. Um so what what's your take on what's driving um the the rally before we had this correction? Of course. Well, I mean the the correction I mean gold's 4,100. I mean there's no correction other than the fact that gold got to, you know, almost 4,400. But there's probably only been I haven't counted them, but just a handful of days where gold's even traded above 4,100. So what what happened is gold just had a big spike and then kind of retraced that spike.

>> But you know, it's hard to say gold's in a correction when it's at $4,100, right? I mean, this is >> up until a month ago that would have been an all-time record high. >> So, but I think the driving force uh has come from central banks. Now, maybe central banks didn't drive it up to 4360 that week. Maybe that was some, you know, spec money coming in finally off the sidelines, you know, jumping on and then, you know, getting slapped. But I think for the past couple of years, the move from 2,000 up to 4,000 was driven in large part by central banks.

And why are central banks buying all this gold? Well, I think they can read the writing on the wall with respect to the US dollar and they are looking to replace their dollars with gold. To have more gold backing their currencies than dollars, you know, backing one fiat currency with another fiat currency doesn't really accomplish much, but backing it by gold does. And I think the central banks have a lot of reasons to do that. Number one, it's political, especially after Biden sanctioned Russia. Uh that was a warning to other nations. You know, you could be next.

So, don't have a lot of dollars, don't have a lot of treasuries because, you know, we'll use it against you. We'll pull the rug out from under you. So, that was a, you know, a warning shot that we never should have fired. I I I I said it was a mistake when Biden did it. Um, number one. Number two, now that the deficits are two plus trillion as far as the eye can see, uh now that we've passed the big beautiful bill, which made the Biden deficits even bigger, I think it's pretty obvious to our creditors that we're never going to get our fiscal house in order and therefore we're never going to be able to repay the debts. So why own treasuries? Uh it's either going to be a default or massive inflation. So better get out now. Uh so the fiscal situation is

clear. Even the Republicans won't do anything about it. Even Trump won't do anything about it. Uh and now I think the last thing apart from the tariffs, which I think pissed everybody off and created another reason to get out of dollars, is the fact that uh Trump is now taking over the Fed, tearing down what remains of the pretense of Fed independence. He's packing the Fed with his cronies. He's going to reappoint a new Fed chair that'll be an uber dove. and he's, you know, we got the Supreme Court decision on Lisa Cook where the Supreme Court might strike down the very idea of an independent Fed as being unconstitutional and basically say, look, the FOMC members must answer to

the president. Uh there's no fourth branch of government in the Constitution. I could see them ruling uh that, you know, the president has to be able to fire them because he's an elected official and they're not. and and and so you know and it's not like the Supreme Court because yeah, you can't fire Supreme Court justices, but the Supreme Court is a third branch of government that's in the Constitution. The Federal Reserve is nowhere. You know, in fact, a lot of times they say the Federal Reserve is the most powerful person in Washington. Well, then but but who's he accountable to? Nobody. He does. Nobody votes for him, right? So, I think the Supreme Court uh may tear down Fed independence, which is going to be a problem because I think that's going to lessen confidence in the dollar uh that

we have a more politic politicized Fed, which is going to lead to uh a weaker dollar and higher inflation. Look, what is Donald Trump calling for? He wants massive rate cuts. That's bad for the dollar. That's bad for holders of US uh treasury. So, I think the the movement, the rotation out of dollars into gold is not only going to continue, but it's going to broaden. I think central banks that haven't been buying gold are going to start buying. I think the those that have been buying are going to buy more. And I think what's really going to happen more next year is that individual and institution investors, they're going to start buying gold. They

Individual and institutional demand for gold

haven't been buying gold in decades. They're going to start buying, right? You look at Morgan Stanley recently came out and said that the 6040 portfolio, you know, need needs an upgrade and it should be 60 2020 where it's 20% gold and you cut your bond allocation in half, which is also a big problem for the US government because if foreign central banks are selling their dollars and US investors are selling their dollars to buy gold, who's going to be buying all these bonds that the US government is selling? The Fed is the only one left standing, which but that means more inflation because the Fed can only buy bonds if it prints more money to pay for them. And that just means more inflation, a weaker dollar, which

drives even more money into gold. Yeah. Well, they should have said it should stay 6040, but then 60 shares and 40 hard assets, including gold, just dumped the the bonds all together. [snorts] >> Oh, yep. Yep. >> And um just go just to zoom in again on the on the central bank buying. I read this article in the economist this weekend and they tried to explain the gold rally and they were mentioning all sorts of sources including central bank buying but then they said if you look at the IMF reports it's not even that much that they're buying compared to the total gold stock but what the economist completely misses is the the secretive buying right because we all know especially in our space that China has been buying much more than they're officially disclosing and I guess that applies to many central banks. Yeah. I

Secretive central bank buying and Fort Knox

mean, I'm sure, look, if you're a big buyer of gold, right, the last thing you want to do is let all the sellers know how much gold you want to buy or how much you've been buying because the price will go up. So, if you want to buy as much gold as possible at the lowest price possible, you're going to, you know, keep your cards close to your your vest so people don't know what you're up to. [laughter] >> Exactly. So yeah, I I I I think that China probably has a lot more gold than it admits to owning. On the flip side, we may have a lot less. [laughter] That's, you know, because we haven't had an audit of Fort Knox in well over 50

years. Um, and you know, even the Donald Trump administration early on, they were talking like, "Yeah, we're going to audit the Fed. We're, you know, we're going to audit Fort Knox. We're going to find out how much gold we have." They haven't talked about that in a long time. They completely dropped that. >> Why is that? >> And well, you know, the skeptic in me is probably that maybe Donald Trump was told by somebody that that's not a good idea because we don't have all that gold and we last thing we want is the world to recognize that because that will be a big problem for us. Um or maybe they need to get it back. Maybe they they have it legally, but they've loaned it

all out and they need to get it before they do the audit. But the problem is if the government has loaned out all that gold, uh what if they don't get it back? What if the people who borrowed it sold it short and they don't even have it anymore? >> Yeah. >> So, who knows? I mean cuz the US government may have been selling gold secretly or making it available so to to suppress the market. Um so who knows but obviously 60 with the London gold pool for example. But >> yeah but if the US government asked for its gold back that means the people who borrowed that gold have to give it back and if they don't have it if they sold it they have to buy it back which of

course will push up the price. So maybe uh without us realizing the Fed is is the Treasury are trying to call all sorts of people to send back the gold but it's not >> so they can do the audit >> or just right Trump on the one hand he he he promised to end the war in Ukraine. He promised to release all the Epstein files. He promised to order the gold. It's just basically too big of all these promises. He's not able to deliver on these promises. Is that going to be in the end also his downfall then that he's he promised too much and he can't deliver? Well, that's look, that's what politicians do, right? They promise stuff to get votes and and and Trump promised everything to everybody. Look, you remember he promised no taxes on expats. He was going to eliminate the US

Trump's broken promises and his ties to crypto

income tax on expats to get their vote, right? He hasn't even mentioned that ever since he was elected. So, those guys got totally screwed. Um, uh, he kept his promises to the Bitcoin community. Um, and but you know that enabled a lot of the Bitcoiners to cash out, which is I think what happened. You know, uh, there are a lot of people now that are hoping he keeps his f promises on Fanny and Freddy. We'll see. That would be another massive mistake. But, you know, if he's if he's more interested in rewarding his friends and donors than helping the country, then maybe they'll be able to try to pull pull that IPO off. But, I don't know what he's going to do. I've said about a crypto that unless there's a US government bailout of of Bitcoin, uh it's going to collapse and I don't know

that Trump is going to bail out Bitcoin even though his whole family now is, you know, completely invested. Uh but that's what people might be betting on. But the optics will be pretty bad, you know, especially if they have to fill up the strategic Bitcoin reserve as a Bitcoin bailout fund. Like if they say we need to buy Bitcoin to prop it up, how could it possibly be a strategic reserve if if it needs a bailout? The whole the whole purpose of a strategic reserve is to use that when you're in trouble. You can't use your strategic reserve to bail out what you could claim is strategic. It needs to be in reserve. Uh so I don't know. I think, you know, he's going to Trump, but a lot of people are going to

lose a lot of money. A lot of people are going to lose their jobs. There are a lot of people now that work in the crypto industry. They're going to be unemployed. Not only are they going to be unemployed, they're going to be unemployed and broke because a lot of the people who work in crypto are all in on crypto. They own crypto. That's one of the reasons they're working in it. So, they're going to lose their jobs and their net worth at the same time, which is, you know, a dangerous combination. Yeah, final question, Peter. In terms of risks that you see, you talked about crypto. How do you look at AI? Is there also a bubble forming and how do you look at uh some of these um uh problems we see currently in the private credit markets? Uh we've seen a few companies

Crypto and AI bubbles forming a super bubble

already going on there. There's all sorts of problems in that market, subprime, student loans. What are the the sort of the main risks you see that could also trigger a a crash in markets in the coming months? >> Yeah. Well, look, there's bubbles everywhere. That's what the Fed has been doing. They're forever blowing bubbles. That is the problem with um the monetary policy. But yeah, I agree that we have a bubble in AI. I think the AI bubble is bigger than the crypto bubble, but the crypto bubble, I believe, is bigger than the dot bubble. So, you're talking about some massive bubbles when you combine them into a super bubble. You know, I think that the main difference between the crypto bubble and the AI bubble is at least in the AI bubble, there's

something real going on there. Just like with the internet bubble, the dot bubble, there was something real there and some companies like Amazon, you know, emerged out of that, right? But the vast majority, you know, submerged permanently and went bankrupt. you know, you got a handful of companies, you know, eBay made it out of the originals. Price Line is still around, but the vast majority, 90 plus%, you know, just, you know, completely shut the doors and that was it. Um, AI is real. I think AI, you know, has even more potential than the internet as far as improving the quality of human life. And maybe not

just the quality, but the duration, right? There's all sorts of stuff that if we can really have artificial intelligence and combine it with robotics, so it's not just mental labor that the machines can do, but skilled physical labor and just manual labor. Then in the long run, we don't have to do anything, right? we we we we you know we'll we'll just have whatever we want and we'll have an army of machines that are smarter than us and stronger than us to do all the work, right? That that's ideal society. We spend all our time on other pursuits, right? We do we do things that we enjoy and of course ultimately we'd wipe out poverty. we, you know, you know, so in

the long run, this is a great uh thing uh that we've we've invented and it has more potential than anything I think I've seen. The question is how long is it going to take to fulfill that potential? And do a lot of the investments that are being made now in these data centers, are they even going to be necessary? I mean, you know, it's like who knows, you know, how much more efficient things are going to be? Maybe we won't need all these GPUs. I don't know. And I also think that there's just a lot of money that's being, you know, uh, spent and it it seems to me like it's way ahead of itself. And I don't know how we can cover the the finance costs because we're spending a fortune.

Where's that money coming from? Like, you know, what aren't we doing in order to do this? There's not an unlimited amount of capital. And so, if it's all going into building out data centers and all this equipment, what are we not doing? You know, what what what is not getting funded? That's going to be a big problem. And the benefits of AI may take 5 or 10 years or more to really start to show up. People think it's going to happen overnight. You know, I things generally take longer than people think, even though the technology itself is is very very promising.

So, I think they're bubbles. I think both these bubbles could pop. The internet the the the crypto bubble is almost a complete waste of resources, malinvestment. you'll have very little left. Maybe I don't know how much demand there will be for stable coins. There'll probably be something for uh stable coins backed by uh you know fiat currencies. I mean I could see a role for those. Um I certainly see a role for tokenized gold. To the extent that you you know you want a stable coin, you might as well have one that's stable with gold because gold is stable. Fiat currencies are not. They just go down.

Gold holds its value. So I think ultimately and ironically the wi the blockchain winner will be gold, you know. So blockchain isn't going to make gold obsolete. It's going to make gold better. It's going to it's going to make gold more efficient as a medium of exchange than it's ever been. Uh so it's it's it's not the end of gold. Bitcoin isn't the end of gold. Gold's the end of Bitcoin and it's the beginning it's the beginning of uh of gold. >> Gold is the new gold in the end. Yeah. Well, thanks so much uh Peter for your time and and your insights. Where can people find more about your company and yourself?

Outro

>> Well, first of all, if you want to get in on the ground floor with T- Gold and start building up your account, you can go to t-gold.com and sign up for an account and buy some gold. If you want to take delivery of your gold or silver right now, go to shiftgold.com and you can get immediate delivery of gold and silver bullion. You can either talk to one of our representatives at shift gold or you can just do it yourself. Just fill up your shopping cart, check out. you know, we've got a very efficient uh online shopping uh site now that's relatively new. I, you know, for years I only had uh human uh uh people that, you know, in order to get it done, but I've now kind of automated that. So, uh you can try that.

>> Peter Schiff, I break this tech. >> Yeah, if you want to. Look, I've got a lot more of my money. I have physical gold and silver and I have mining stocks. Most of my money now is in the mining sector because I think they're so ridiculously cheap. And yeah, I think gold's going to go to 10,000 or higher. But $10,000 gold from here is not even a triple. You know, it's, you know, double and then, you know, two and a half times. But if gold goes to 10,000, I expect my gold stocks to go up at least 10x from where they are now. Uh if not more, quite a bit more. So that's why I'm putting my chips over there because I'm so confident that gold's going a lot higher. Uh and so if you want to join me in that trade, you know, we have a gold

strategy at Europeific Asset Management. you have separately managed accounts. You can buy my gold fund no load if you're in the US. Uh EPG IIX is the no load symbol. We're going to be coming out with an ETF soon which you'll be able to buy anywhere. Uh you know, even if you're not in local, but that's not here yet. It will be out next year, but right now it's the mutual fund or separately managed account. And again, EPGIX, that's the no load symbol, which is the one you want to buy. Otherwise, you're going to pay a load. um or you know talk to my representatives at Europe Pacific Asset Management and they'll you know guide you through the strategies, talk to you about the funds uh wrap accounts that we offer. Then I have a newsletter

uh uh shift sovereign I recommend people go there and at least get the free letter uh you know it's worth every penny but we have some great content comes out two three times a week you get a letter in your inbox. We have some paid letters if you want some of our research if you kind of want to do it yourself. We have some great investment research in in the mining sector to help you pick your own stocks. So, you can subscribe there as well. And then, you know, I'm I'm out there social media. Make sure and follow me on X, Peter Schiff. Listen to my podcast every week. I do at least one a week, if not two on Shiff Radio, and they're available, you know, iTunes, Stitcher, you know, uh, you know, everywhere. They have um, you know, uh, podcasts. And I've also do a

weekly podcast now on Shift Gold. I do the Shift Gold Friday market rap. Uh so check in there and and subscribe to that and you know stay a breast of what's going on. There's a lot of new information coming out, a lot of news. And I think most of the mainstream media gets it wrong. >> And and so I think if you want to really understand what's going on, you got to look for alternatives to the mainstream. And I think I am one of them. I'm not the only one, but I'm certainly I think a good a good a good one. >> Well, you were the one of the first people I started following back in 20089 after the GFC. So, thanks so much for everything you've been uh sharing since then and I love your confidence, love your honesty. Um so, thanks so much

Peter and also for for making time available today and I'd love to talk to you again in the future. >> All right. Thank you. Anytime. >> Thanks, Peter. Bye.