41° AVC Subcommittee Meeting | Accessibility Scope Bounded Mutable Alignment Artifact | Maker

Transcript

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picture I see juliia Anam Builder T name Clocky Rocky Blue Pipkin hello hello we're about to start and uh thank you thank you for time on our subcomittee meeting today it's accessibility scope uh very interesting what is happening right now also in in the Forum I'm pretty sure you're all aware we're GNA be discussing also a little bit of this important topic of the new changes in the proposal for the different Scopes that includes also governance that actually um this scope is going to be

focused um next week but uh we're going to try to um some details or insights with um The Proposal that that was uh that was updated in in the Forum uh about today we have an important guest we have Alex vas from Co and uh since this is accessibility scope we want to know a little bit of insights of this widget that they have how if necessary like how could that be implemented to uh to make her uh we're going to discuss a little bit of a d of the user experience

of censorship resistant I think that all of these topics are important to get to understand a little bit more and what could be useful for maker in general so um to give a little bit of of context here we are uh re needed uh people from I mean ecosystem actors we have community members that includes ABC members that includes delegates um but also this is been recorded and this has been streaming in in in Twitter so yeah more probably more more people are are um watching us right now I I know for a fact that Alex you have presentation which is perfect so I'm going to stop

sharing my screen and first before you start giving uh the presentation just letting you know that if it could be like not way too technical so more people can understand and also if you start by introducing yourself we would like to know like which is your role in in the protocol what do you do what's your experience and then you yes you can start giving us your presentation and thank you so much for joining us thank you thank you for having me can you guys hear me yes so pretty good Okay cool so thank you very much so I'm Alex as Chris said I work at cab cow

I mean want to be like you know super accurate is cow and my work at cow revolves around marketing and also like business development in the past I was more focused on on on the kind of like community and marketing side of things but now I'm also focusing a little bit more on the BD and partnership side of things and I do have a presentation so I am going to share my screen and please let me know if people can see it yes we can see your screen here okay cool so to start with maybe

I'll give an introduction of cow in case there are some people that might not be aware but cow goal is to create the most protective products and Innovations around ethereum and and as well as in other chains and this kind of protection products revolve around three main pillars which are like you know best execution H intent based architecture as well as M protect protection and right now C has three core core products core pillars which are C km which is the first MV protecting MV capturing sorry amm to be

deployed in ethereum and this amm basically allows liquidity providers to not suffer from lvr and lvr is sort of the fancy new term for the old impermanent loss and basically lvr is that um there are these offchain to onchain Arbitrage opportunities and if you are a liquidity provider onchain then you constantly get Arbitrage at the cost of H gas prices being too high to actually rebalance your position to have the correct price then we also or the Dow also has an own me blocker which is the number one M protection RPC simple RPC that you can install in in your wallet

and basically it allows you to interact with any sort of ethereum application with front running and sandwiching protection and in the case that you're doing a swap or a transaction that actually carries value and it's back runable then you get up to 90% of the reate and lastly the the Crown Jewel which is C protocol and C protocol cow swap or the C widget in here is the number one intent H int 10 base Dex protocol in ethum as well as in NOS chain and the whole idea from this protocol is that we're leveraging batch auctions because it allows us to behave

sort of like an amm and an aggregator but by having this layer this batching layer on top of the amm and aggregator we can actually execute multiple intents in a in a single transaction and this has several benefits because you kind of um do this model of account abstraction for the users because they just have to sign a message for trading as well as you know peer-to-peer matching and several optimizations that unless you patch transaction together you cannot find in other forms of trading so up to here this is a short well I guess it was a bit long but short summary of The of Cal and but in here I

was proud to actually talk about the widget so what is cop widget basically cop widget right it's the simple plain widget that you see on cop right it would be like this square and it allows you to bring you know all the all the goodness or all the goodies from that you see in the current cop interface to your website da or application like however you want to kind of install it and the beautiful thing about this is that you know from a very easy installation process and without having to break your head too much you're able to install this kind of bucket a square and therefore you're able to give to

your users or to your audience M protector swaps because even though the users might not be going to the cop interface this doesn't matter because when they submit the order it's going to go to the underlying protocol which is called protocol and the whole batch auction system and the the solers kicking this is regardless of where the order flow is originated from the point of view of kind of um a website or or kind of like a project that wants to you know find its own path across crypto you actually have a bunch of benefits that are here besides like the best prices in MV

protection the interesting part is that this widget allows you to actually set up your own partner fee schemes for example you can say well you know because of the Simplicity that I'm bringing I'm gonna be charging from the price improvements 15 BPS like you know which is 0.15 not only that but then there's a lot of like customization that can be embedded within the widget like you can basically customize the token list so you can create your own token list and it's super easy you just have to you know pick the tokens that you want and and suddenly will be the default so for example if you are a more I don't know financial application or you want to be

more kyc you can actually restrict the list of tokens to those tokens that you want or let's say you're in the case of maker maybe you want to be biased and hey I'm only gonna offer people the only stable coin is going to be a d or any subsequent form of d whether it's yield bearing d s die you know other other forms of D but this is the only stable coin that you'll be able to find within the widget well you can do that not only that but then you can also change colors you can also change the the type of orders that you offer because this is also the good thing about the widget that is not just like a market order Standalone you also have like Advanced

order types and and one of the I guess you know most underrated factors of C protocol or in general cow swab is that um we I guess we don't follow the term by the which account obstruction got famous but we were one of the first teams to um show a version of account obstruction in because through gasless trading basically and through intents right the users what they say is they they sorry they delegate the execution of the swamp to a third party which is the sers and they tell them my intent to trade is I want to swap A to B can you just please find the best option to do

so and a to B being any type of erc20 token and at the beginning of course this you know mainly evolve around your normal most average C20 tokens but you know throughout these years this has evolved that you can actually like use LP token as your sell token and you know go directly into stable coins without having to withdraw and then swap or the other way around right you can already jump into a bolt into a pool uh with any type of token as the as the buy token okay so what are the three type of orders that you're going to get if you

integrate the widget well the plain one right is Market orders is these orders that are current market rates basically e there s don't limit orders because within the slipage so the f fill or kill and within the slipage that you said basically that's going to be like your lower limit price and these are executed as soon as possible and depending on the time that you posted it might be like at the beginning of the batch or at the end of the batch the speed my my VAR but like here is what H kind of the widget looks like right you also have the breakdown of what the user is going to receive what are the current price and actually what are the gas costs to

execute this transaction this is also something to take into consideration because a lot of people tend to think and especially within like the UI scheme of things in terms of competitors they hide the fact that you have to pay with gas and they lure you with the word free and as you know in the world there's no free launch if something is free is because you know they're not giving you their right appropriate price or someone like you know it's maybe a screw is big of a word but like you know kind of taking advantage of you because no one especially in crypto kind of has a charity for your behalf so in this is important to see that like castless

means that you're just not going to need if okay maybe this is a about example because the sell token is if so you are paying with if but if I had usdc here right I would pay the gas fees to execute my transaction with usdc or if if we do it the other way if I if I'm selling as time then I can pay the gas cost of this transaction on on S time and then even another cool thing is that with s die since is a a a permit function token you can actually like for example send SD to a wallet and if this wallet has never interacted with cwwa but they want to change their SD to whatever other token they can do so

without needing h e because they're GNA pay the approval and the swap gas f with STI and yeah and then this also gives you m protection and then in the settings another Gem of a feature that is often hidden that I guess is more for accounting or like operations kind of handling that you can actually set a different custom recipient for your soap right like in case let's say for example we've seen this no people don't want to do a donation but they have this token that they want to compare to a stable coin and then just send it directly to the address that receives the donation you can all this you can do all these together without

having to do two transactions you basically just specify the custom recipient and then the solver will send the the end result to to that specific address then the other fact the other type of order that you get from integrating the widget right is limit Surplus capturing limit orders and the cool thing is in here you basically Define your own price you have gasless order management you can place as many orders as you want without getting charged gas fees you can cancel them without getting charge fees and recently we actually added this H cool feature that you can actually Place orders without a balance which is convenient for certain strategies because for example say that you're pending to

receive this claim s i and you want to leverage this SD to open up a new bolt or something so in a sense you want to execute transactions in a in in a chain of actions you can actually like place the limit order that's going to trigger the first transaction so you say like okay whenever whenever I whenever s reaches this price or like this amount this price Improvement opportunity execute and then you know convert the STI into this other thing these other token that I want to be exposed to and then this in combination with something that we're going to launch very soon which is hooks allows for a lot of um use cases pre and post

interaction but the best thing about this is that for example in in this case for limit orders they're not your average limit orders where you simply just set the price and then whenever the price reaches there um the the order executes in here there Surplus capturing and what does this mean it means that your limit price is always respected because in competitors limit order you you know let's say you want to sell H eth to S die when when eth reaches 4,000 well yes you get executed at 4,000 and technically you don't pay gas cost but you do like you know you receive less output tockets and if you dig through

ether scan you're going to see that realistically if you do the math instead of exe instead of your limit price being executed at 4,000 you're executed at 3,998 you know7 because someone has had to pay for the gas cost in here in C protocol the cool thing is that because there Surplus capturing right the order is not going to execute until there is enough of a price Improvement to cover for the execution for for your transaction so this means that in the example that we were saying that instead of triggering a 4,000 the solver needs to find a price Improvement that will get them let's say

$4,003 to then subtract the gas cost and then execute the order at your limit price while on the regular kind of example this might seem not very great is actually in the moments of you know Market uptrends that this becomes beneficial because whenever you place a limit order and there's huge volatility and if you know H reach for ,000 in all the other limit order Solutions you get executed at 4,000 but this is because in the block that you're actually traded maybe if was trading at 4,200 well in the case of cowo you do actually capture well sorry C protocol

you do actually capture this H Surplus because there's the competition to execute your limit order as close as possible to 4,200 so this is actually very beneficial because then you could you could do certain like stable to stable coin strategies like especially with let's say d to S die whenever there's like price improvements you can kind of you know automatically trigger the the game and then also another Advanced order type or I guess the Main advanced order type is tab which is a Time weighted average price order and this is for example very cool if you want to exit out a position or if you want to

use Siti to enter into a position why right this is important if if you're trading like large sizes because mainly it minimizes the price impact in a sense tab is allows you to behave sort of like a dollar cost average it's not like an average per se but like you kind of like break the part the tawa parts into the same uh amount to buy and like slipage or Price production and you know when they execute so it's like similar but not exactly the same but the coolest part is that you can actually enjoy this price price protection which is a bit better than slipage because within price

protection you specify right the market price that you you'll be willing to take for your order and if this price like you know if we're in part seven of the tawa and the market is below or sorry is above the price protection that you said then the order is not going to execute because it's breaking one of the rule the rules that you said and mainly like with tab right the benefits is that you have lowest LePage lowest price impact you also have Surplus and you also have customization of how you want or exit these positions and this becomes relevant because I don't know say you're a cohort of maker now and like you know you have to pay salaries and

you want to sell for the year 10,000 e do you want to really do it at one chunk and risk like all the market movements of e or do you want to just slowly sell the 10,000 e in equal parts to s in each part you know and kind of instead of trying to be Gordon gecko just more or less let the market time your orders instead of you time in the market so yeah and again the widget from the tech side of view or the developer side of view is 100% configurable like you have a life sty configuration if you go at widget. you can already test it today and see how you want to do it if you

want to do it on like d mode or stand Standalone you can even connect your own wallet and change the theme light to dark pick any colors for the text paper or whatever you know decide if you want to only use we were saying before type of orders the network the sell token and so on so it's 100% configurable if you want to inject like the wallets from an external point of view or internal point of view like within the widget or in the typical connect your wallet talken above and then also I mean I guess I don't understand why with someone would do that because it's also one of our key features but you can actually change the sounds you can make I don't know a pig

sound or or whatever sound or even just get rid of the sound and most importantly the widget is fully responsive all right and and in here uh this is more or less the architecture of the whole protocol and to give an overview right and how what are the efficiencies or how does the widget kind of bring efficiencies to people that want to enter into s or you know if maker th where to integrate this widget what are the efficiencies that can be brought to their system so in this case we see that right the the these are the different front ends the they can be front ends you can also have

like a b or script or whatever but since in this case we're actually giving having an overview of the widget we see this and through the through the front end widget right you call this API who then puts the order in this order book and then we have this piece called the autopilot that is the one in charge this this is the one in charge of the auction so we could call it the auctioner and then this auctioner distribut the orders to be solved to all the solvers and then the solvers can post back their Solutions and the auctioneer ranks Whoever solware has the the highest price Improvement for the given orders of the bunch and then this solware that

gave the best price Improvement to all these orders gets the right to submit on on chain so this solver then actually gets to call the settlement contract and then this settlement contract is the one that actually executes the routes and then and the result being that the users receive the token but you know while it might look very complicated from the architecture point of view the main point to have is that you know before right H the users if especially like for example for for STI right you have to go let's say in the case of NOS chain you'll have to if you are already

on NOS chain you have to deposit the Tok well you have to approve the tokens deposit the tokens then meet the SDI and then State those are like four steps four steps that okay maybe someone that has been long enough in crypto can afford to do them and knows how to do them but they're still annoying and there's still four steps that can be saved into one and same goes to like you know opening a CDP or a bolt or a LP position there are all these different steps that you need to take that are kind of you know slow and repetitive and not necessary well the cool thing is that in the widget you can already kind of um show the output token

that you want to offer to your users right so in the case of SD if I have E I can already jump into SD without having to do this approval deposit meaning and and and and staing and essentially is because these solvers are the ones that are like doing all these instructions telling the settlement contract to like do these instructions on my behalf but this doesn't mean that like my tokens are still like you know the transactions that the settlement contract is going to execute is going to be deposit and mint and and restake it's it's this is done more or less on behalf of You by the solvers so the solvers are

just basically going to say c the s that is sitting here and giving to these users not only that but you know the power of C protocol because we aggregate multiple intents together you can actually combine the transactions right which is more or less the icon I was trying to do here H you can offer better rates than a liquidity pool if the if you're matching users like the buying side and the selling side directly in a peer-to-peer way because you don't have to pay the liquidity provider and as it turns out in most of the cases liquid like you know the counterparties can be matched together like very precisely and therefore you avoid paying

the smart contract fees for interacting with these liquidity pools and the liquidity pool fees and lastly ER here is H the last question that I guess I'm going to try to do I'm not the best technical person to answer all this stuff but but H where is the widget store right so for convenience cwab does store the widget in an iframe based URL which is the swap. that file URL but this doesn't mean that it's not decentralized or that it cannot be served in a decentralized way right you can actually use if you want CW if the limo as a base URL for your widget you can actually also see

the ipfs pin has where the link is there and I can share this SL later where you can access directly the the ipfs version of CA you can also build your own cop UI and host it in your own server and then basically just replicate and and serve the same UI that is serve on cop but you have control of the server or lastly you can completely Fork your version of cop and color whatever you want and actually deploy it in your own you know flavor or taste that you want we actually have this as an example we actually have this protocol that is launching on Monday

that what they did is um they leveraged the C protocol to H give their cohort of users a privacy preserving way to put orders in the co protocol order book and what they do is that they encrypt the order as soon as it's create as soon as the user creates it through their widget and once the order is encrypted it will not decrypt and arrive in the C protocol order book until it's the moment of trigger so ultimately like instead of having resting orders in the order book which kind of if you're very like try or you know font manager you're leaking information so you don't want to do that

well in this case they're they're kind of bypassing that by encrypting the order and only releasing at the moment of it execution and with this they would simply like just Fork the widget very easily adapted to their flavor and then added this intermediate step that allow them to do their side of you know their side of the deal their technology and then everything works as easy peasy and yeah so basically the efficiencies that uh in general you can achieve with the widget or or with cop alone like if if you go through the main interface as well right you can directly mint SD because your your route is completely abstracted you don't have to have e because as I said through the

gasless approval a user can actually swap SD to e without any e on the wallet they just need enough Siti to pay for the Swap and then the things that are coming is that you're going to be able to enjoy more root obstruction basically more yield bearing tokens are going to be able to be handled by the solers and the more and more products that I created and the more uh routes that the solers are going to integrate and then lastly is something that I also briefly mentioned is that very soon we are going to launch this cook store which will allow users to kind of build their own transaction

flavor and this will also come with the widget so you can adapt it to your website as you want and the whole idea is that you add this pre post interactions to your swap so basically you can say Okay claim my S rewards swap them into e and then Bridge them to this other channel or the other way claim my e usdc rewards swap them into SD and Bridge them into arit room because pendel is offering high yield over there for SDI borrowers or or lenders and yeah so basically like this is just a demonstration like it's very simple it's like a very few lines of code less than 10 and here's another

example of the customization of colors that you can do yeah oh thank you I don't know if there's there are questions I think this has been with with the pictures with the examples I I don't know very uh Dynamic I guess um so was too boring was not it was not I think I was going to comment actually on the way that you explain it it was not too slow was not too F was like the the perfect so people that are not into it people that are not too technical can understand it um so thank you I I wanna I don't want know if there are people

that understand more about this and has like a technical question I think this is the perfect moment I do have some comments on your presentation um you you mentioned something about the sounds and you say like why would someone like care about the sounds and I think that it would would work perfectly for the subow so to put into context basically it's the narrative is that about community and that uh that will work actually pretty well to have like every subow configurating in their own mood I don't I don't know but uh it would make sense I think um then about sharing this slid so more people can take a look and

can um I don't know have the experience of of using the the the particle I think that it's perfect so I'm going to ask you by the way you're still sharing your your screen just to letting you know and um and yes we I mean just if you didn't want to us to see your your screen yeah um and I have some some documents that some documents some some questions that are not too technical but I would like to know your insights on um what are the main reasons uh a user like stop using a platform stop using a um application like what someone needs to take into account when it comes to the

using experience because I think we all what we all want is that to be okay user friendly to to have like a bigger adaption so more people can interact with our platform with with our frontend um you have mentioned some but what would you say that are the most important I mean I think is like usability and and transparency I guess because I feel like more or less where things are going are to abstract the users from everything and a lot of the information is hidden and not saying that like

they're hiding it because it's bad but it's sort of then harder to understand what's happening like in the case of Kao for example I'm cool with not controlling certain parameters but we do show kind of all the information and like break it down as much as possible whether as in other places it's harder to find this information so it kind of makes it seems as if they're hiding it but for the usability side of things I mean yeah like in it sounds cliche right that I'm G to say this but like intense abstracting the users from thinking right is the the thing that you

know users like the most and we haven't really figured out a way yet to make it visible within UI the the possibilities that currently are offered within cop because for example not of people tend to be aware of of this like oh you know with with s die or with any stable coin die or whatever jump directly into an LP position you can do this or into a ball it's also harder because you know the tokens are not as find in Co Geo maybe and you need to go on ether scan or you need to go to these other page and import the address and maybe people are not comfortable and and also the the the rate at which these kind of solutions

pop up it's hard for us to keep up to you know double check that if we are to offer like a token list this is the right address like people are not getting a scam and and and the complications that mathematically bring to the competition but this is something that it is possible for like a small set of uh tokens and we're we're working to refine the UI to show it more for users like to make them perhaps understand understand or like see in an easy way that they can be exposed to that and and yeah more gasless sort of execution because once you try selling a token

without any e like even even the approval you're like wow this is great because that's a bit of a barrier still right especially for new users oh I don't know a friend sent me S okay now I need eth or whatever chain I am I need the native token of that chain to actually approve oh how annoying and and and still like some of the account instru Solutions feel like I need to send the SD to them and then they do the thing for me still feels a little bit I know intrusive and not trusty so with cop is cool because or or with a widget SLC protocol because you basically just sign messages you're like okay well if this gets to execute in the conditions

that I want then sort of yes solver I allow you to take this s di from my wallet that are going to be swapped to whatever or this token that are going to be SWA to S and use them for the gas approval transaction and for the actual swap gas fees transaction yeah lot of things that I think that most platforms or most STS should be taken into account this conversation also reminds me that uh like not so long ago I was participating in a hackathon and we were creating h a platform like a landing platform and so

what we were like discussing is like less is better it's like not to have too much options that could make users I don't know uh instead of helping them is going to be like distracting them or it's going to be like okay what is this for just have the tools that is going to be like really needed H and like simple but I don't know if that's your point of view as well um but for example with with the whole new structure with this endgame what maker trying to do is to have a like big a bigger adoption like to have um yeah more more users and that

includes like to be okay more accessible to have more to be more user friendly I think like the most people would think about makers like oh wow this is like complex uh a protocol so um that's why I think that this has been very you know I don't know helpful um I don't know if there's anything else that you would like to to add that you haven't mentioned yet I think this is the the and also I think there work some comments on the chat from unnown Builder I'm gonna read now um it says it was very interesting the method is quite straightforward how does the commission part of the widget work yeah yes so basically in the in the

there are these fields that are hidden to the user right but because essentially like the order that you sign in a pretty interface gets translated into ugly backend Json style parameters and within there H you you have a a subsection that's called partner fees and and if if in the case of cwab right that section is zero but if you have your own widget and you decide to have partner fees then that field is going to be like I don't know 15 BPS and then the solvers are going to um you know take that into consideration and within their calculations of the price that they're

going to give they're going to actually return the funds to the settlement contract and then you know let's say if you have um 10% or 15% BPS then maybe it's five cents then instead of getting $1 you get 95 because 5 cents get stored in the settlement contract cost they are for department and then on a on a weekly basis c c protocol the treasury team kind of uh forwards you your percentage of the of the partner fee that you have accumulated and there is more because I see that

Anam biller still typing uh but while they're done um yeah please take this moment to to mention what you you have a few minutes to to mention what you haven't yet or to probably um point out something that it's the most relevant from all of this now against the spot the most relevant I mean I think a lot of people because of the hypeness of crypto don't take the solutions that interacting with in the same way that

they or in the seriousness that they would take other Financial um stuff but it is important to actually check these things and it's and it's also important to you know um how I say partner up with projects that even though you might have slightly difference they're still there for the long run and they have common values as to where you know what ethereum brings or what the entire crypto ecosystem brings so yeah I I I do think cop is one of them and one of the fews that we can say that we're not Trend

jumpers or Trend attachers because you know you can see that we've been live for three years and the only net not chain but the only main Network we're on is on ethereum and this is because we still think there was a lot of things to improve within the landscape of ethereum swapping and there we were needed way more there for protecting the users and you know refining a product that gives the users the best M protection while giving them the best prices with you know so with the sacrifice of I guess losing market share or not being as known because we're not jumping on the the new layers that are just popping up

like crazy and yeah I want to say more because if not I never shut up speaking that was that was good and one last comment from Al buer says and yes maker is trying to centralize the front end they will offer a referral code and the front end that brings the users uh receive a fee but the system is very similar uh it does has help a lot this uh explanation uh and we'll see we'll see uh what is which one is the um prodct protol there's going to be like I don't know if if partner but they going to use um but this what this has been very helpful I think that sometimes we

people tend to think that everyone is an expert in everything every little thing and and this kind of um conversations help a lot to oh look at that I didn't take into account this particular part so yes it has been very helpful and uh if there is nothing else to say well again thank you so much Alex oh thank you for the invite any time we're going to continue and we don't have much time left but uh by the way Alex if you have to to live if you want to stay that's that's a new thank you um but when it comes to

the what has happened like with the proposal the modifications and that we know that ABCs are going to um are going to go going to shut down my concern it's just I'm not so sure when is exactly going to happen I don't know if any any anyone could give like a better explanation uh or we have to to wait until run get more clarification on when exactly so we were discussing internally and probably is going to going to be the whole month so may and then um uh well June no ABCs so if that's the case uh we're going to to continue we're going to be working on our documents probably

um yeah before before next month yeah before next month okay let's see um yeah that's what yeah I agree with liberta should be by the end of month so um yeah we don't have that much uh time left but I think it's also oh okay great explanation in product says an builder for there but yes I don't know how is H all the ABCs are going to do with this um I was like catching up with with with K ABC I think there was like like a discussion on okay what should we be focusing on as ABC now that the quarter is not gonna be done

like it's going to be prior the quarter right so um and I see that also liberta from resiliency um so it will be really good to have to know what are like plans as others ABC has uh so far we're still like discussing it um but yes I think that for everyone like for every member of uh navc like the priority is to have all the documents ready um prior the end of the month um and yes I think that I don't know maybe in the upcoming days we'll have more info into this and since next week is governance goal we be discussing this but just to letting you

know like any suggestions from 0s from other ABC members I'm also um glad to have you here libertas we were we were gonna we're gonna read also uh your discussion from your last last night or here last night um but yes everyone thank you so much for joining us and um yes see you next week byebye